Eagles Nest to Repeat?

[snakedoc]

Just remember, whenever State Park rules are violated, and whenever munchkins or old, Ben Gay smelling divers are threatened,we'll be there. Who are we? We are the United See Something Say Something Underwater Cave Coalition International Team.

So to anyone who believes they can violate State Park rules, know that USSSSUCCIT... is watching!

[mbaker]

Good one snakedoc!!

[Mudhole]

I just searched NAUI's verify a member feature, and 51486 is a valid number, but has not been renewed for 2014 yet. For someone who has first hand knowledge, and wants to file a complaint with NAUI, Marty's given name is Gregory.
NAUI's phone number: 813-628-6284. Ask for Randy Shaw or Jed Livingstone.

[Maureen]

DAN's position, correctly, and in line with the AAUS, is that no data means no diving. It is not that the risk is too great. No data. They don't know. They always say if they don't know, then don't do.

My point is that I don't believe there is a scientist who put their support behind this with no data. I think Dad is making this up. If not, perhaps he would like to cite the publications where this data is available.

But the real issue here is that some believe they have the right to impose their will, their views, their version of belief, on others. and that's wrong. I know better than you so you now must do as I say? My logic is better than yours? I wouldn't behave that way, so you can't either.

Um, isn't this kind of what democracy and order are intended to do? Complete anarchy doesn't really seem to work in most places. And since this occurred in the US state park system, where rules which limit your behaviour do exist, I am not really sure what your point is.


I think most of the concern is about breaking the rules in the state park and how it may affect the cave diving community.

[snakedoc]

Saving this in case it is edited in the future due to the email sent to an admin of this site.

His composition needs to be edited (and soon). Perhaps while consulting with the "diving scientists" at the various Universities, he could find time to consult an English professor as well.

[JerseyJersey]

I too have a few points to add and might as well throw them out there.

1. I believe that "see something, say something" is not an epiphany of original thought. It is a concept that was begun in my open water training. Watch who you are diving with, look for these things before diving with someone, explain problems. It continued through my cave training. Watch who you dive with, mention the dangers and explain the necessary to untrained divers..... It is a thought that just had not until now been verbalized in a catchy phrase format.

2. This thread would have been here whether 'see something, say something" had been thought up or not. It would have been here sans the nanananana how is see something say something working out for you.....nananana

3. Divers already do practice see something say something, even if they don't realize it. Lets use the recent Cow Springs video thread as an example. Saw something, said something.... how did see something say something work out for us there?

4. Other examples are: the jerk who left his used condom on the picnic table, the one who blinded me with their lights on the way out of xxxx, the peeps who stirred up all the silt in xyz.
All the people who stopped and talk to people who ask questions, or the ones who turn back free divers or escort lost single tankers out of caves.


5. Just because the thought is verbalized is no reason to not use it responsibly.

6. Verbalizing something we already do in a catchy phrase is simply a good reminder and can be used as a proactive example of something we already do.

[cavewoman]

I can't imagine seeing a 10 year old on scuba period nevertheless walking to the water wearing doubles. Selfish dad.

I've seen plenty, in fact I've known 10 year olds who were better divers than their parental counterparts. Not going to comment on the situation posted here....but in open water I see no issues with a 10 year old learning to dive under safe conditions.

[Tegg]

I've seen plenty, in fact I've known 10 year olds who were better divers than their parental counterparts. Not going to comment on the situation posted here....but in open water I see no issues with a 10 year old learning to dive under safe conditions.

Agreed.

[gsxr1997]

gsxr1997, I don't see how your comments are related to the conversation but.






see
http://www.naui.org/recreational_divers.aspx


"As long as you are 10 years or older and in good physical condition, you can enroll in a NAUI Scuba Diver course. Find a NAUI Training Center or Instructor near you by visiting the Dive Center Locator. Sign up for your class, grab your bathing suit and get ready to have FUN!"


and


http://www.tdisdi.com/sdi/get-certified/


"Children ages 8 and 9 can experience scuba in a pool environment with an instructor and when they turn 10 they will be able to complete the Open Water Scuba Diver program and earn their certification card"




i'm sure all agencies have done there research and because they don't want lawsuits, maybe since your an instructor you can find out the details and provide some valued information.






As a fellow NAUI instructor,I would be interested to know who these scientists are and if they are validated by studies(not!)
I personally will not train any student less than 12 years of age ....

[/QUOTE]

plapin- How it relates is simple- the instructor in question is diverting attention from himself by stating he has the blessings of scientists- I call BS on that!
As far as my comment - I do not have to accept any student I feel is not capable of diving safely. NAUI may have set minimum standards 10 but ,unlike other agencies,I make the final determination and may exceed any and all standards provided they are agreed upon by the student and implemented without prejudice. I will not take students less than 12 for a multitude of reasons,foremost the lack of understanding of the reality of death or serious injury that may result from not following the rules(this is not a video game where you hit reset)
NAUI held out for many years after all the other agencies followed PADIs lead on reducing minimum age standards. The reduction was an economic decision on all fronts. When a family of 4 wants to get certified before the big cruise vacation and little Johnny is eleven,a NAUI shop could not certify him ,yet the shop down the street with another agencies banner could certify them all,where do you think they would go?
I personally have no beef with him as a dad taking his kid diving.That being said, exceeding the limits of a junior diver cert.(If it indeed happened) reflects badly on him particularly as an active instructor. Violating park rules is the other issue.

[gsxr1997]

Just for the record,my NAUI instructor # is 44981