DIC Investigation

[Gary]

If he checked into Cow

I highly doubt he checked in at Cow and would have no reason to not go upstream even if he weren't Abe Davis.

However he would have to be a cave diver to find the upstream entrance (he was probably shown it by someone) and to hit so many caves in as many days. Most of the locations were within a 1000' of the entrance and with in range of an Intro diver.

[BgDadddy]

I haven't seen the damage, but would smoothing it in with hand tools used for working with concrete do anything? It probably wouldn't make it look normal, but it might at least help cover up the damage... Just a thought.

Rick

Obviously the logistics are an issue. Obviously the clay bank will never be restored to it's original form. But to me what is more obvious is that we cannot allow this "DIC" to remain even at the risk of some additional yet minor (hopefully) cosmetic damage. Even if we smudge the formation at least it isn't graffiti. At least Mr. DIC doesn't get the satisfaction of leaving a permanent mark.
I've been thinking about this. If a diver was able to "securely" tie off a rope horozontally (to the left and right) across the formation and maybe 3-4 feet away from the damage, the repair diver should be able to either cut or brush away the graffiti while maintaining vertical bouyancy control and using this rope for horizontal stability. It might require a few set up dives but I believe this to be a workable solution among many imperfect options.
It would require patience, a steady hand, and practically flawless bouyancy control but is IMHO entirely possible.
This is just my input and I would in no way attempt this myself without the support and blessing of the local cave diving community. That being said......Let the brainstorming begin!!!

[Jordan]

However he would have to be a cave diver to find the upstream entrance (he was probably shown it by someone) and to hit so many caves in as many days.

Yep and this would be further comfirmed if he has been to the Crypt. That takes a couple of jumps and some navigational know how. There must be several of us who know this DICK.

[mgersch]

Not only do I think that we know DIC.
I would think he/she has posted about it on one of the web forums saying how awful it is.
and secretly loves the attention. I'd look at members of this and other forums. Even if they hadn;t posted on the subject I'm sure they's be reading about it.

Great work done already on the topic following up those leads. But I wouldn't necessarily expect whoever it was to have signed in at the dive sites.

Or maybe it was someone who signed in at Ginny but potentially not at cow (since Ginny has "fairly" tight security.

Weren't all these DIC sighting in a few days of each other? This might suggest someone from out of town doing a several day diving trip. Although, it doesn't rule out anyone living close by...

I would think it would be someone diving solo.
I would think it would be someonw diving at less crowded times.

[Jim Wyatt]

I have not been to see DIC in the clay bank. Rather than removing it is it possible to hide it? Filling it in somehow with something that at least obscures it?

[Line Squirrel]

I have not been to see DIC in the clay bank. Rather than removing it is it possible to hide it? Filling it in somehow with something that at least obscures it?

That's what I'm thinking, trying to fill it in rather than cut away existing clay. Try filling it in first, it can always be cut out later if the first try doesn't work.

Just for the record, I didn't mean to dismiss Ken's brainstorming, I think it's a good thing that all ideas are discussed. I used to be an automated tool designer for the automotive industry and I had a lot of nutty ideas but those ideas often spawned better ideas, got people thinking in a different direction which often times is what it took to solve a problem.

[Cindy]

Online witch hunt? W.O.W. Never thought I would get to see one of those! By the way my first name starts with a C as does many others. Don't forget first names.

Sorry guys but I think this whole thread is bs. Is this ment to scare people? Let everyone know what a top cop Ken is. I'm sorry but accusing anyone online is just F.U.!!!

Cindy Butler,,,,,and yes, I know my first name starts with a "C", no intention of changing it either.

[Ken Hill]

I'm sorry but accusing anyone online is just F.U.!!!

I agree, no one should be accused on-line its a waste of my time and gets nothing accomplished.

To the forum members, accusations having to do with people or phrases that YOU may suspect will accomplish nothing. Most of the internet stuff has been gone over already "ad nausea" PM me if you have any information.

The GOAL is to identify DIC or make DIC aware that he will be caught in any future attempt.
Having said that I am asking the people who were there to tell me if you saw someone you can identify and who DID NOT complete a release. I might add, all people signing releases have had their identities and memberships reviewed by the CDS, the shops involved and their staffs. Someone has already vouched for you!!! What I hope to do is corroborate the identity of people who have been reported to be seen at Cow in the 10/20 thru 11/10 period, and who did not sign a release to dive Cow.

The list has the initials of twenty eight people who were properly signed in at Ginnie. If you observed other(s) not on the list please PM me. the corroboration to other reports of people who might have snuck in it will be a leap forward.

To be clear, Cow Springs has a clear policy, a diver must either sign a release or sneak in. In the case of Ginnie Springs, who I commend for being most cooperative, divers that are annual passholders are wrist banded but their names are not recorded. Divers may also access the systems by boat.

We have the list of those that visited both Cow and Ginnie and that list has been given a pretty good going over with most of the names identified and removed as persons of interest. Below is the list of divers (Initials) who properly signed releases at Cow. As you can imagine, about half of these divers also dove Ginnie in the same period.

10/27/2007 LB thru 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 RL 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 ML 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 JF 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 SC 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 MCS 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 BJ 10/27/2007
10/27/2007 JPJ 10/27/2007
10/29/2007 MO 10/31/2007
10/29/2007 SS 10/31/2007
10/29/2007 KA 10/31/2007
10/30/2007 R? 10/31/2007r
10/30/2007 MS 10/30/2007l
10/30/2007 ?K? * 11/10/2007
10/30/2007 ?Y? * 11/10/2007
10/30/2007 AA 10/30/2007
10/30/2007 ?M * 10/30/2007
10/30/2007 ?T * 10/30/2007
10/30/2007 AV 10/30/2007
10/30/2007 JB 10/31/2007
10/31/2007 TJ 11/4/2007
11/1/2007 ST 11/1/2007
11/2/2007 CC 11/14/2007
11/2/2007 GC 11/2/2007
11/2/2007 VR 11/2/2007
11/2/2007 VL 11/2/2007
11/2/2007 MK 11/2/2007
11/2/2007 MD 11/2/2007
11/3/2007 ML 11/14/2007
11/4/2007 DM 11/5/2007
11/4/2007 MNL 11/5/2007
11/5/2007 MF 11/18/2007
11/5/2007 TF 11/18/2007
11/5/2007 JC 11/18/2007
11/5/2007 MG 11/18/2007
11/6/2007 TV 11/7/2007
11/6/2007 MH 11/7/2007
11/7/2007 PV 11/7/2007
11/7/2007 ES 11/8/2007
11/7/2007 RB 11/8/2007
11/7/2007 GL 11/7/2007
11/8/2007 AR 11/8/2007
11/8/2007 ?J * 11/8/2007
11/8/2007 IK 11/13/2007
11/8/2007 RK 11/11/2007
11/8/2007 CL 11/8/2007
11/10/2007 WMS 11/10/2007
11/10/2007 KJ 11/10/2007
11/10/2007 KD 11/17/2007
11/10/2007 WT 11/10/2007

* Many cave divers do not share our language, alphabet nor order of first and last names.

Thanks for the help so far. I still need Hobbit experts and someone familiar with Tolkien's, cave exploration, words like "PLUGA" and other cave exploration terms. Thanks again. /Ken

[Cindy]

Thanks Ken, I am sure you mean well. I would like to suggest that any further accusations or ID's that people want to do be sent in a PM to you. I am not even sure of the legality of leaving a post even hinting a fellow cave diver broke a law. Is that slander? Nope, I can't remember the name for writing that type of thing about people. Maybe just bad manors. I personally doubt D.I.C. is worried. I am posting a more writing I found two weeks ago in Dos Ojos cave System in Mexico. This stuff is nothing new nor just a North Florida Problem. I personally would rather see people work on improving cave conservation, protection, education and learn more about how to correct these problems than spend time trying to accuse fellow cave divers off a internet post. Thanks, Cindy Butler

[Ken Hill]

I am not even sure of the legality of leaving a post even hinting a fellow cave diver broke a law. Is that slander? Nope,

S lander is S poken. Written defamation is libelous therefore a personal message is the best way to go. I've had at least a dozen so far; none containing published info.

At any rate I disagree about DIC being worried. We can make a million mistakes trying to figure out who he is. He cannot slip up once. His downside, he can never enjoy a cave dive again! If caves are as important to him as I think they are, and if he is smart he'll come forward. S as in SHAME is something he'll not be able to tolerate. /Ken

PS to steal your phrase " I am posting becaused I am pissed off at this self appointed genius!"