Cave Diver Training Length

[RN]

Chicken, this is in no way directed at you, but looking at these two pages:

http://www.iantd.com/iantd3.html
http://www.iantd.com/IANTD_Course_Breakdown_2009.pdf

... IANTD seems to be the PADI of technical diving.

You can't judge IANTD based on those charts. While they do have a variety of courses, the prerequisites vary. For example, you don't have to take the Recreational Trimix Diver course to take the Advanced Recreational Trimix course. In fact, you don't even have to take Advanced Nitrox to take Advanced Recreational Trimix. You also don't have a be a full Cave Diver to do the Technical Cave Diver. The prerequisite for Technical Cave Diver is to already be certified in Advanced Nitrox or Advanced Recreational Trimix or have sufficient experience or training as determined by the instructor.

So, while the charts make it look like there are all sorts of prerequisites for the different levels, that's not the case. There are just a variety of courses someone can take, but once you take certain courses, then you no longer have to take many of the others because they are inclusive.

It took me a while to learn the standards, and several re-reads!

[jj1987]

Technical cave also allows the instructor to put the diver in the water with a stage bottle at the "full cave" level, which IMO is something that's lacking in the NACD curriculum. I wish it were required like NAUI/GUE, but I don't think it is...(not sure however)

[Sludge]

You can't judge IANTD based on those charts. While they do have a variety of courses, the prerequisites vary. For example, you don't have to take the Recreational Trimix Diver course to take the Advanced Recreational Trimix course. In fact, you don't even have to take Advanced Nitrox to take Advanced Recreational Trimix. You also don't have a be a full Cave Diver to do the Technical Cave Diver. The prerequisite for Technical Cave Diver is to already be certified in Advanced Nitrox or Advanced Recreational Trimix or have sufficient experience or training as determined by the instructor.

Did you read what you just wrote? And how much do YOU charge for the Elite Diver course?

The prosecution rests, your honor.

[chicken]

Sludge, you asked what the technical cave cert was and I replied with the answer. I wasn't soliciting insults. But if it makes you feel better your agency (whatever it is) is better than mine and you are a superior cave diver. I hope someday I can be certified through your superior agency and meet the standards YOU have set for a qualified cave diver.

[Sludge]

The agency doesn't make one a good diver, the instructor does. But the agency makes money every time a C-card is issued. And that's about the only time it makes money.

If you read their course offering, don't they seem to have about five times as many courses as they need?

[RN]

Did you read what you just wrote? And how much do YOU charge for the Elite Diver course?

The prosecution rests, your honor.

It's no different than SDI, SSI, NAUI, or any other recreational agency. The difference is IANTD does it all under one name. Although I'm rated to offer IANTD recreational courses, I haven't taught one and don't go out of my way to market them. I only offer and teach the cave and technical courses through IANTD. So, I don't offer the Elite Diver course. However, for you Russell, I'll make an exception. And I'll even do it for free. You will have to pay the cert fee, though.

But the agency makes money every time a C-card is issued. And that's about the only time it makes money.

Oh, and agencies don't make much on C-cards. The only time they really make money is when they sell student manuals.

Technical cave also allows the instructor to put the diver in the water with a stage bottle at the "full cave" level, which IMO is something that's lacking in the NACD curriculum. I wish it were required like NAUI/GUE, but I don't think it is...(not sure however)

Actually, stage diving is allowed whether it's Technical Cave or Cave. The standards don't specify either one.

[alias]

Kinda not fair not to count in lodging because it would have been hard to pop in back to NY for some sleepyeye. Anyway, I am just Apprentice this far but counting in only cert days' lodging, travel, training an estimating and another 2 day package to finish Full in NFl my price will still squeak to $3000-4000 range. If I left the lodging and taxes out maybe I could just stay in about $2999.99 But counting in realistic expenses (having to stay more than cert days, eat and live), it's def >$3000.

[Bob Cree]

Chicken, this is in no way directed at you, but looking at these two pages:

http://www.iantd.com/iantd3.html
http://www.iantd.com/IANTD_Course_Breakdown_2009.pdf

... IANTD seems to be the PADI of technical diving.

Hey Russell,

Not so sure that is fair. I think IANTD is more of a gas cert agency. PADI...is well, PADI. Apples and oranges.

If you follow the NSS-CDS and/or NACD norms to full cave and carry a stage bottle on enough of your training dives, you can get all three certs at the same time (depending on your instructors qualifications)...NSS-CDS Full Cave, NACD FUll Cave and IANTD Technical Cave.

What the IANTD Technical Cave cert really does for you is more on the gas side - if you do it right. It seems convoluted to me, but as I recall, it "qualifies" you for 100% O2 deco, and allows you go straight from Advanced Nitrox to Advanced Trimix. It really did not strike me that it meant much on the cave specific side compared to NSS-CDS or NACD training at the Full Cave level.

It can provide a shortest possible path to diving deep caves. Cavern/Intro and Advanced Nitrox in one step...Full Cave (NSS-CDS/NACD) + IANTD Technical Cave step two...Advanced Trimix step three. Not sure if you can do the one week to Full Cave approach and get a Technical Cave and Advanced Nitrox as well which combines steps 1 and 2...that would be even shorter...granted, not necessarily a good thing IMNSHO.

ATB,
Bob

[LCF]

Cavern/Intro: $700 tuition, $500 airfare, tanks and fills included
Cave 1: $1800 tuition, $500 airfare, tanks and fills included
Cave 2: $2000 tuition, $600 airfare, tank rentals and all fills were extra and rental van was painful
Full Cave: $800 tuition, $500 airfare, tanks and fills included

[SuPrBuGmAn]

Between 1500-2000 including gas for the car, gas for the tanks, tuition, books, etc. This is a total for Cavern through Full Cave over a couple years, not per class - yikes! I don't think the lodging would bump me into the next area, but it might...