Bad dive at Ginnie

[nkavallar]

If you notice the symptons early enough, while you still have proper control over your breathing, what might help is to get rid of as much CO2 as possible. What I found works for me is to make a deliberate effort to exhale completely for 4-5 breaths, purging as much from my lungs as possible. Of course you can repeat that procedure if necessary.
My own painful experience is that CO2 buildup also leads to a headache, followed by nausea. Did you feel any of that during your dive, I didn't see you mention it in the report but am curious none the less?

About nitrogen narcosis itself, other than reducing the partial pressure, for example through ascending, there is not much you can do. Except of course minimize all forms of mental and physical stress one you notice the first symptons, which might help reduce the effects.

Thanks, this is very helpful. I did not have any headache or nausea upon surfacing, but I also did 5 mins of O2 at 19 feet (I did't have any deco required by my nitek q) so that may have helped.

[Andreas]

Also if anyone has some good tips to improve breathing and lung functions, please feel free to share.

While you do cardio exercise on land, focus on exhaling fully, even using your abs to really empty your lungs on each breath. If you do this enough you will hopefully create a habit of it so that when you encounter a higher level of stress/work during a dive you will start to ventilate your lungs more efficiently. You can also take an advanced freediving class to help you find some good breathing exercises. Just be careful so that you don't get more tolerant to CO2, which will lead to you building up CO2 more easily during SCUBA dives.
Also, many of the training organisations teach you to ALWAYS breathe slowly. Well, that is unfortunately not true. If you have any tendencies to retain CO2 you will need to breathe more/faster than what you feel is necessary.

You likely already know about the more obvious "tricks" such as using easy breathing regulators and using a lot of Helium even on shallow dives.

Best,
Andreas

[skip]

Thanks, this is very helpful. I did not have any headache or nausea upon surfacing, but I also did 5 mins of O2 at 19 feet (I did't have any deco required by my nitek q) so that may have helped.

AOW to Cavern, then Intro, then Apprentice.... when does decompression procedures come in? I thought that was a tech class, although I think some instructors permit deco in Full Cave. Never heard of Apprentice level doing deco, but I'm not a cave instructor.

And although everyone seems convinced it was CO2, or Narcosis, or some combination, I'm thinking maybe it was just plain first dive solo in Ginnie after what was a stressful week. There was a thread here several years ago about getting the heebie-jeebies in caves. Some claimed it happened to them every time at the same place in the cave, or only some times but at a certain place if it did. Others mentioned how a little stress and/or anxiety unrelated to cave diving sometimes seemed to increase a lot in the cave although they anticipated that the dive would help calm them down (it didn't).

On the CO2 side, UHM and the Navy, publish articles from time to time on low, medium, and high CO2 retainers and the effects of depth. You might be a high CO2 retainer. If so, you might want to look into it and change some of the ways you dive based on some comments here in this thread about breathing strategies, but even then high CO2 retainers are a very special concern in diving, let alone in caves. check it out.

skip

[nkavallar]

AOW to Cavern, then Intro, then Apprentice.... when does decompression procedures come in? I thought that was a tech class, although I think some instructors permit deco in Full Cave. Never heard of Apprentice level doing deco, but I'm not a cave instructor.

And although everyone seems convinced it was CO2, or Narcosis, or some combination, I'm thinking maybe it was just plain first dive solo in Ginnie after what was a stressful week. There was a thread here several years ago about getting the heebie-jeebies in caves. Some claimed it happened to them every time at the same place in the cave, or only some times but at a certain place if it did. Others mentioned how a little stress and/or anxiety unrelated to cave diving sometimes seemed to increase a lot in the cave although they anticipated that the dive would help calm them down (it didn't).

On the CO2 side, UHM and the Navy, publish articles from time to time on low, medium, and high CO2 retainers and the effects of depth. You might be a high CO2 retainer. If so, you might want to look into it and change some of the ways you dive based on some comments here in this thread about breathing strategies, but even then high CO2 retainers are a very special concern in diving, let alone in caves. check it out.

skip

Thanks Skip, to the point of Deco and Apprentice training:
NACD: Cavern and Cave Dive Student Workbook
Apprentice Limitations, P.94
"Limited Decompression only. This is the first level at which the diver may begin to lengthen the dive by exceeding No Decompression Limits. Limited Decompression means the use of a decompression gas on a single stop. .... The diver is ENCOURAGED to obtain this experience through Nitrox, Adv Nitrox and Decompression Procedures courses."
I do have the Nitrox courses but not the Deco which isn't a requirement. However I have discussed this topic at length with my instructor and also have a couple of decompression books and manuals from TDI and other that I've read and familiarized myself with Deco, GF's and so forth. I will repeat the same dive this saturday with experienced buddy / buddies. I will let y'all know how it goes.

[a64pilot]

If you want to experience mild CO2, go on a fun dive with a couple of friends in open water, not even deep, but really concentrate on skip breathing, try to really conserve your gas supply

[FW]

The times I have been narked relatively shallow (over 100', but under 130') was from swimming hard. CO2 apparently adds to the N2 to cause narcosis.

[TONY CHANEY]

Just a question: for those that say that they are a CO2 retainer what was your CO2 and HCO3 from your ABG (aterial blood gas)?

[Kelly Jessop]

Just a question: for those that say that they are a CO2 retainer what was your CO2 and HCO3 from your ABG (aterial blood gas)?

pCO2?

[cavediver256]

Just a question: for those that say that they are a CO2 retainer what was your CO2 and HCO3 from your ABG (aterial blood gas)?

Alright some Acid Base Balance !!!!!!

[TONY CHANEY]

pCO2?

Yes. And sorry for leaving that out. Thanks Kelly.