P II

[bent]

More like my awareness of the overhead isn't top notch... and with a cave that goes up and down a lot... like pretty much every single cave I've been in... I tend to run into the ever changing ceiling. My last dive was only twice.... compared to right after certification it was like every 100 feet. But I think 2 times in 2200 feet is still a bit much.

What kind of cave instructor would let you pass a cave class when you constantly bump into the ceiling? In some caves you would really break a lot of stuff when you do that... that's pretty sad, don't you think?

If this is all a joke and I'm not getting it, than I'm sorry.
If you are being serious about this constant ceiling bumping, your instructor clearly shouldn't have let you pass any kind of cave class.

[twaldo]

What kind of cave instructor would let you pass a cave class when you constantly bump into the ceiling? In some caves you would really break a lot of stuff when you do that... that's pretty sad, don't you think?

If this is all a joke and I'm not getting it, than I'm sorry.
If you are being serious about this constant ceiling bumping, your instructor clearly shouldn't have let you pass any kind of cave class.

Again... you OBVIOUSLY are not reading all the posts... I'm just telling people what they want to hear because I'm getting tired of being attacked. This feed started out with me asking a simple question about PII until someone thought I shouldn't be asking questions... so now its just feed the flame....

Just said it once and I'll say it again... get over here and come dive with me... If my buoyancy sucks... tell the world.

I met the requirements or I wouldn't be certified.

[twaldo]

You recently posted something on FB about a 1.9 SAC. I honestly had no idea that was possible.

I doubled it by mistake... I've been running in the .95 to .97 range.

But then you flatter me... you follow me on FaceBook

Drysuit in hand... getting ready to goto Gamble for required repairs. but when I DO decide to dive with it it will be with Ice Diving as the intended goal... not to protect your ego which seems to be the bigger picture here since you suggested I just wear a skin so I LOOKED like I was in a drysuit, you were not concerned about my staying warm near as much as how it made you look when we both were at the same site?? and I'm not the one freezing.

I"m pretty sure this whole thread went down hill when you suggested I should pick other mentors and quick asking stupid questions on CDF.

Just a thought.

Tim

[kensuf]

Those OW divers were violating their standards... we are all adults, but then they don't have gas limitations and are not in an over head environment. I tell my students there is NOTHING stopping them from diving to 300 feet after they are certified, but that I really wouldn't suggest it because they don't have the training or experience.
I do believe that when the 6ths rules were created there was a reason for it but maybe now it is time to revisit those reasons.

Umm, Tim, they violated a depth limitation on their very first dive out of their certification class. Remember, OW cert means they probably came into that with no diving experience.

There were several,some with things involving DPVs. If you think about it the safest cert level is cavern diving. Remember a certified cavern diver having an accident while diving with in their level (School sink and P3 don't count)? We have cavern diving accidents in Mexico,but those are noncertified cenote tours.

I know there were several intro diver fatalities in years past, but it has also been a few years since we've seen one. However, we've seen a few full cave diver deaths since then, some were health related, but of course there was the scooter fatality earlier this year and the carbon monoxide incident in Cozumel and the OxTox incident in Devil's. It would be interesting to look at the number of fatalities and certification levels, I believe Steve Gerrard had done much of that work before with his CAP beast article, maybe it's time to update his work?

I think that "diving within their level" is the key here. School sink, and P3 were certainly beyond the cavern level. The intro diver that died in P1 doing a circuit, was way over intor level. Same for the intro diver on the DPV.

Patricia Barkley, 2010. That was five years ago.

Has there been an intro certified diver death since then? I honestly don't know; there have been OW divers in overhead fatalities, and there have been full cave fatalities, but I don't recall an intro diver in the past five years.

Just said it once and I'll say it again... get over here and come dive with me... If my buoyancy sucks... tell the world.

I'll bite. Just like Draker, get your drysuit fixed and I'll be happy to take you on a fun easy dive well within the limitations of NAUI Cave 1.

[MikeT]

It's when I become the joke

too late

[twaldo]

I'll bite. Just like Draker, get your drysuit fixed and I'll be happy to take you on a fun easy dive well within the limitations of NAUI Cave 1.

YOU I will take up on that offer... you don't have an ego to protect even if your GUE is bleeding into your NAUI just a tad. I am technically within NAUI standards with my current dive exposure. That being said, if I continue to live in N Florida I will be diving Dry in order to get comfortable with buoyancy so I can get my Ice cert soon, not because I'm freezing in the springs.

Also, if we are both at the same dive site, if you see me do something wrong or a change you feel would be beneficial (dry suit aside) I am ALWAYS open to constructive criticism from anyone that didn't already have an agenda.

Tim

[twaldo]

too late

Yeah... that pretty much happened when I moved to N Florida.

[bent]

Good, I was hoping you were kidding. I read all posts but sometimes its hard for me to tell, whether people are being serious or not.

I met the requirements or I wouldn't be certified.

Unfortunately I have seen people in caves that had horrendous buoyancy control and they got certified too. It's a real bummer but in some cases, being certified doesn't mean much.

[rddvet]

. But I view a NAUI Cave It's a "zero to almost hero" course.

Wow, very different view. While I agree naui cave1 isn't for all, I definitely don't see the zero to hero you're talking about. I see it as a way to allow for slow progression. Maybe that's just my mentality over others.

[twaldo]

We chose it for the "slow progression" scenario.... but Ken has a point, the Cave1 does jump a bit ahead of other agencies... and he is a NAUI instructor. The concept was that we could stay Cave1 for as long as we needed without having to get cards re-issued (seems to be a problem of late) and progress to next level when we both felt that it was time.