Vetting buddies

[harmstrong]

Over the last few years, I have both petitioned to dive with people, and been the recipient of requests to dive with us. In the beginning, I was rather laissez-faire about it, but experience has changed me.

I recently wrote a long message to someone, both giving my husband's and my bona fides, and requesting theirs, and as I wrote it, I could envision the person on the other end being offended and annoyed at being asked for this information. I wanted to know with whom they trained, how much experience they had, and where they had dived. I don't think I'd be angry with someone for asking for those things, but I could see someone else being that way.

When someone contacts you from out of the blue, what do you ask for, to be comfortable going into the overhead with them?

I ask pretty much the same questions you do, with one addition (if I don't already know)- "Who do you dive with that I know?" Then I call those people (provided they are people I have dived with and trust) and say "Talk to me about so and so." If someone I trust doesn't vouch for them, it probably isn't going to happen. Even if someone does vouch for them, we are doing something really easy to get to know each other first time out.

[OFG-1]

Vetting buddies?? Hell, I dont even have a Vette.

[BgDadddy]

I'll pretty much dive with anyone with a cave card, but we're doing a simple main line dive the first time so we can get comfortable with each other's skills, ability, awareness, etc. There have been divers divers who have never gotten a second dive, and others who I continue to dive with.

[Brent]

Let me jump in here from the instructors point of view. It's pretty much safe to say that anybody who has a full cave card is safe to dive with. I know we all have our favorite instructors and NOT so favorite instructors but having said that, I truely believe that we all do our best to insure that an individual with our name on his/her c-card is as good as they can be upon graduation day. Now, here comes the rub, as the saying goes. A guy that I certified TEN years ago and has only been back to Ginnie once or twice in that time frame probably is not your best choice of a dive buddy without a LOT of conversation first and perhaps even a tuneup dive of sorts. This is a sport of use it or lose it and I go back over 20 years of teaching in this business so when a student from say the 95 time frame calls and wants to do some fun dives I really want to know what's been happening since we last met. Here's a point ALL instructors can relate to ( even PADI types of which I am one ) We certify perhaps thousands of folks but how many of them do we continue to see. Yes, our cave community is much smaller but the point is well made. How many divers continue on and how many folks dive once or twice a year. So the next time somebody approaches you at Ginnie and is looking for a buddy-------
So much for my opinion.

Brent Booth
NSS 241

[Sharky1948]

As a relatively new cave diver, I feel like I'm at more risk from being with a less than fully proficient buddy than those of you with far more experience. While I'm comfortable with my own skills and will not push beyond what I feel is within my experience and skill level, I wouldn't want to combine a "stretch" dive with someone who could add complexity or risk to the dive. So, I think there are two sides to this question, depending on whether you are very experienced or whether you are new. We newbies need to gain experience. I'm way OK with someone "grilling" me about my experience and I always check out new buddies with someone I trust. Just because someone tells me (s)he has experience doesn't cut it. I want to know they are experienced and dive safely (vs. having been lucky for some time.)

I'd like to continue to enjoy this passion for many years to come.

JMHO

ps. And, BTW, I think the instructor DOES matter when you're thinking about diving with a relatively newly minted cave diver. Over the years I've had great instructors (including my cave instructor, whom I would gladly provide positive references for) and instructors in other technical diving disciplines that were border line dangerous and from whom I learned more of what not to do rather than what to do!

[LiteHedded]

depends on the dive

[FW]

... I truely believe that we all do our best to insure that an individual with our name on his/her c-card is as good as they can be upon graduation day....

Having dived with a lot of cavedivers trained by many instructors over the years, I would agree for the most part. There have been a few "card peddlers" though. Fortunately most of them have been removed by their own agencies. I do agree with the recent experience. I was "stuck" with a buddy once that hadn't dived in a year, and was a "seven day wonder" anyway. It was the only time I actually had to unwrap my long hose. As it turned out, he wasn't really out of air. He had failed to check the crossover, and it was closed.

[tomhauburn]

Keep the dives simple and evaluate. Some people are natural in the water and have great skills but some do not even have them even if they dive a good bit. Its hard to know although someone who does not dive much is more likely to be rusty. You can see differences sometimes who who trains them sometimes but not always. This weekend ran into a guy wanting to take cave classes. He been diving doubles in overhead wrecks for 20 years will more than like have less issues with Single tank diving going to cave class. ( Unless he has a lot of bad habits )

[MORGAN]

One of the many advantages of having a cave diving wife is that I always have a buddy. Even so, I have done cave dives with quite a few people who were at Dive Outpost or a dive site and needed someone to dive with. Some of them have been intro or apprentice, some were newly minted cave divers, some had comparable experience to Tracy and I (185 cave dives), and some have had vastly more experience, like FW, who we first met when he was wandering around the Peacock I parking area looking for a buddy. Some of the folks we met this way have become regular buddies. One was introduced to us by our cave instructor, who said "Tracy and Mike, meet Nina. I just certified her full cave, and she's looking for somebody safe to dive with." I thought that being called "safe" was a profound compliment.

I have yet to have a bad experience with a "pick-up" buddy. We are pretty conservative about all our diving, and dives with a new buddy are always simple ones. The only thing that would make me unwilling to dive with a new buddy would be evidence of testosterone poisoning - someone who seems like they want to push the envelope or have something to prove. So I don't quiz them about their diving resume; we just chat informally until we have a good feeling about each others' experience, expectations, and attitude.

When Tracy and I were intro divers and new full cave divers, several people went diving with us when they could probably have been doing something more interesting with more experienced buddies. We try to pass it on when we have the chance. And still being relatively new ourselves, we're always grateful when more experienced cavers are willing to show us something new.

Mike

[diveconjeff]

I'll pretty much dive with anyone with a cave card, but we're doing a simple main line dive the first time so we can get comfortable with each other's skills, ability, awareness, etc. There have been divers divers who have never gotten a second dive, and others who I continue to dive with.

Pretty much the same story with me. The talk ends when you hit the water and its show time.

Since I have never been the "undisputed best" at anything, my attitude is always be prepared to share a lesson, giving some and taking others.

There was a similar thread on the forum a while back. The following weekend I was at Ginnie getting ready to dive with someone I never dove with before. He asked me who my instructor was and I told him. I asked if he had any other questions, and his reply was, "If he certified you, that's good enough for me."

In turn I asked him who his instructor was. FW then smiled and told me the story of how the first three instructor numbers were decided on ...