Graffitti in JB

[TONY CHANEY]

+1 for what Skip stated.

[SuPrBuGmAn]

It's just that the more people talk about this on the internet, the more likely the guy will find out we're on to him, and it will give him more time to cover his tracks.

That'd take a pretty big eraser dontcha think?

+2 Skip

There's already too much secrecy in cave diving politics :P It often seems like, what should be, the most capable cave organizations are the most afraid of their own shadows...

[Sludge]

That'd take a pretty big eraser dontcha think?

No, all this guy has to do is make a public announcement, on FB maybe, that he's heard that someone is trying to frame him by writing his name in the rock in JB. That's enough to raise reasonable doubt.

Maybe I should just send him a FB message and advise him of such.

[FW]

Wasn't it Skip that warned about the dangers of saying too much on the internet just a couple of pages back?

See post #33

[Squirrel Girl]

Do you guys who are all for open discussion and lack of secrecy believe we should be posting up our troop movements in Afghanistan? Who cares if our servicemen and women might be killed. It's unamerican to keep secrets. We have the right to know!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, I'm being sarcastic. There times when too much is kept secret and I may argue for more exposure, but I complete reject the argument that nothing should be secret. Reasonable people can discuss the merits of particular topics or incidents and whether privacy is appropriate in any given case.

If Edd and the JCSO want things secret, that's good enough for me. I mean what the heck difference does it make if *I* (or you) know how the sheriff is conducting the investigation. He's got Edd to collaborate with. He's surely not gonna come read the CDF to learn how to do his job.

[SuPrBuGmAn]

No, all this guy has to do is make a public announcement, on FB maybe, that he's heard that someone is trying to frame him by writing his name in the rock in JB. That's enough to raise reasonable doubt.

Maybe I should just send him a FB message and advise him of such.

Is that all it takes?

Do you guys who are all for open discussion and lack of secrecy believe we should be posting up our troop movements in Afghanistan? Who cares if our servicemen and women might be killed. It's unamerican to keep secrets. We have the right to know!!!!!!!!!!!

Do you really find some similarity with this thread and the war on afghanistan? Can you be more dramatic?

Yes, I'm being sarcastic.

Oh, OK, good... I thought the crazies were escaping again

I mean what the heck difference does it make if *I* (or you) know how the sheriff is conducting the investigation. He's got Edd to collaborate with. He's surely not gonna come read the CDF to learn how to do his job.

I agree, but I also think the doofus who gouged into the walls probably doesn't have the CDF on his favorites list anywhere.

[Squirrel Girl]

Do you really find some similarity with this thread and the war on afghanistan? Can you be more dramatic?

That was as dramatic as I could come up with, without trying. Some people on this forum seem to need to be hit over the head by a 2 x 4 to understand a point.

I agree

Amazing

but I also think the doofus who gouged into the walls probably doesn't have the CDF on his favorites list anywhere.

I have no problem with someone having a differing opinion on a particular example. It's the giant, sweeping, overriding, "always" statements that just aren't true that I have a big issue with.

[SuPrBuGmAn]

I have no problem with someone having a differing opinion on a particular example. It's the giant, sweeping, overriding, "always" statements that just aren't true that I have a big issue with.

Agreed, when the always people show up, you should take a stand. I'll help

[ssmdive]

I just have a hard time thinking you can get convicted if not seen doing it.
Someone could write my name but it doesn't mean I did it. If somebody wrote "John Doe" ol' John gets blamed and it out money for lawers and such but in the end it looks like a question of did someone see him do it?
I think writing something on a cave wall of any type is about the most ignorant form of expression there is, other than maybe cow tipping.

Maybe, but if we have receipts from John Doe at the local gas station, a fill payment from a local dive shop, their signature in the log book at the dive sight.. etc... Then it is not a stretch to conclude that if his name is written on the wall that he did it.

[skip]

All Hail WikiLeaks! Open up them secrets. Reveal all. Truth can not live in secrecy, only Lies live in secrecy. When we claim to be honest good people, then employ torture and subterfuge against our enemies we are doing nothing but showing the world we are the Liars. I would not have troops in Afganistan. So secret troop movements would not be needed. It's not a perfect world and our government will always keep secrets, but that doesn't mean we have to. And if these guys learn that the CDF is out to get them, so what? I really doubt that a few days or weeks headstart on making up a cover story will change anything. I mean come on, if you can't prove that they were there, had the opportunity, with few there before and after the crime....well, then you can't really find them guilty. If we have our ducks in a row, no amount of advanced knowledge we're looking for them will get them off the hook.

Now if they are dumb enough to brag on FB, post pics, etc., no need to hunt much further. And that's really what my earlier post (#33) was about, not that we should all go hush-hush.

I've said it before....we need signs to alert people that scratching names and graffiti in caves is bad form. The desire to leave a mark, to paint, scratch, write your name, in wet concrete and cave walls is just too great. A simple sign explaining how this is not a proper place for such behavior would do more for cave conservation than all the hoo-haw of prosecution after the fact.

I got a hundred bucks to donate for signage. Who's gonna make them and install them?

skip