I need info

[bgillespie82]

In my english class I have chosen to write a persuasive paper claiming that allowing cave divers access to sink holes and springs will be benificial to Florida. My main focus is the Wakulla/Leon counties but I speak of all systems. What i need is any information with credible refrences on Financial gain from local counties from cavers (im trying to use marianna as some evidence to this claim but need actual evidence rather than word of mouth). I also need any info on our help with providing information to the state or DEP. And last any information that is about our efforts to keep these springs clean and undamaged.
Any help will be greatly appreciated and If all goes well I will be sending this letter to our local government.

[FW]

You should focus on benefits, like an increase of knowledge about ground water. The state doesn't care much about making money from cave diving.

[bgillespie82]

I dissagree,
With all of the budget cuts going on I think that Florida will be looking for other sources.

[bgillespie82]

Look at what has happened to Marianna, most of that was done because it brought money in to the town. Florida also gets its money from tourism and cave divers make a part of that

[Bill Rotella]

This says it all to me, I am not a tourist, but a man that respects and enjoys the beauty of God's Creation that we are privilidged to see:

The National Speleological Society and the Cave Diving Section believes; that caves have unique scientific, recreational, and scenic values; that these values are endangered by both carelessness and intentional vandalism; that these values, once gone, cannot be recovered; and that the responsibility for protecting caves must be assumed by those who study and enjoy them.

Accordingly, the intention of the Society is to work for the preservation of caves with a realistic policy sup-ported by effective programs for: the encouragement of self-discipline among cavers; education and research concerning the causes and prevention of cave damage; and special projects, including cooperation with other groups similarly dedicated to the conservation of natural areas.

Specifically: All contents of a cave - formations, life and loose deposits - are significant for it's enjoyment and interpretation.

Therefore, caving parties should leave a cave as they find it. They should find means for the removal of waste; Limit marking to a few, small and removable signs as are needed for surveys; and, especially, exercise extreme care not to accidentally break or soil formations, disturb life forms or unnecessarily increase the number of disfiguring paths through an area. Scientific collection is professional, selective and minimal. The collecting of mineral or biological material for display purposes, including previously broken or dead specimens, is never justified, as it encourages others to collect and destroy the interests of the cave.

The Society encourages projects such as: establishing cave preserves; placing entrance gates where appropriate; opposing the sale of speleothems; supporting effective protective measures; cleaning and restoring over-used caves; cooperating with private cave owners by providing knowledge about their cave and assisting them in protecting their cave and property from damage during cave visits; and encourage commercial cave owners to make use of their opportunity to aid the public in understanding caves and the importance of their conservation.

Where there is reason to believe that publications of cave locations will lead to vandalism before adequate protection can be established, the Society will oppose such publication.

It is the duty of every Society member to take personal responsibility for spreading a consciousness of the cave conservation problem to each potential user of caves. Without this, the beauty and value of our caves will not long remain with us.

[bgillespie82]

thanks Bill

[FW]

From the FL State Parks webpage:

"The mission of the Florida Park Service is to provide resource-based recreation while preserving, interpreting and restoring natural and cultural resources."

It doesn't mention making money at all. The NSS-CDS, and NACD, have been working with the FL Parks Dept for over 30 years, and have gotten access to a few sites with a lot of hard work from countless volunteers. We have pointed out many times that they could increase revenue, but they continually point out that making money is NOT their mission.

Whatever you do with your letter, please don't insult the parks dept, or make them angry at cave divers. Access to Peacock, Madison, Manatee, etc could be lost as a result.

[OFG-1]

In my english class I have chosen to write a persuasive paper claiming that allowing cave divers access to sink holes and springs will be benificial to Florida. My main focus is the Wakulla/Leon counties but I speak of all systems. What i need is any information with credible refrences on Financial gain from local counties from cavers (im trying to use marianna as some evidence to this claim but need actual evidence rather than word of mouth). I also need any info on our help with providing information to the state or DEP. And last any information that is about our efforts to keep these springs clean and undamaged.
Any help will be greatly appreciated and If all goes well I will be sending this letter to our local government.

You have created a circular arguement. Local counties will not get ANY money from the sale (ie, renting or charging to use parks) of state owned lands, with the exception of some local taxes on additional tourists. And as much as I hate to tell you, cave divers are not a large group.

If you want to research this, try to see how much money has gone to Madison County from the divers at Madison blue since it became a state park. If you want actual evidence, get in your car, drive to the court house, ask their financial personel, don't try to get other people to do it for you. Ask the city of Mayo about how much peacock has generated for their local government.

The monetary arugement has been beaten to death for 30 years by groups of people with a lot more experience.

Try wrapping up a good arguement around this, although there is no monetary gain for the property owners:

http://asci.uvm.edu/equine/law/recreate/fl_rec.htm

[aw]

Governments are in place to serve the people. There shouldn't be a "what's in it for us" mentality in government. Rather, it should be "what resources do we have stewardship over and how can they best be utilized?" opening up lands owned with sinks, etc that could provide value addedness to the community and enrich the lives of others should be the focus.

If they are afraid of lawsuits, etc. then they should change administration heads in favor of those who are willing to accept some level of risk in the interest of maximizing resources for ALL citizens, and not just what makes the administration comfortable. If they don't want to be bothered with the hassle, then they shouldn't be in office. You need go-getters. Folks who don't operate primarily out of a spirit of fear. Unless they've got a valid reason a site should remain closed, then they are obligated to at least investigate the option.

I believe even if cave diving provided no benefit to the local community, the fact that there are God-given resources on that property, raises in them the responsibility to maximize its use. They are stewards. And God can take it from them just as quick as he gave it, or even remove any self-serving heads that be.

[FW]

Look at what has happened to Marianna, most of that was done because it brought money in to the town. Florida also gets its money from tourism and cave divers make a part of that

Marianna is a little different, because it is the county, not the state that owns the caves. The local area does get some benefit from cavediving there, lodging, food, the diveshop....

On the other hand, if someone did an analysis, they would see that it is a drop in the bucket, compared to other activities, like swimming for example.