The "New" Ginnie

[guru caver]

Glad I amuse you, but if I were trying to irritate you, I would just correct your spelling. (now THAT'S annoying!)

All I have to say is that this 'secretive crap' disturbs me because with the dive community's growth rate, even if nobody ever talked about any caves, it's just a numbers' game and people will find things on their own, it's just a matter of time.
So what's better; some diver finding a cave and doing whatever they want?...or a diver with an experienced mentor to show them different and better ways for diving a particular system?

[john]

Glad I amuse you, but if I were trying to irritate you, I would just correct your spelling. (now THAT'S annoying!)

how do you loose access to a river cave?

No ones perfect.

[MengTze]

...
So what's better; some diver finding a cave and doing whatever they want?...or a diver with an experienced mentor to show them different and better ways for diving a particular system?

A valid point.

[Cindy]

Guro caver, you are right, a mentor is a great person to show you a cave. You have dived with them before. You know the person. You advance through stages and learn as you grow, just like when you dive with a good cave instructor like your husband.
What they are doing is using the cave to promote an event. They are taking people into Rock Bluff they don't even know. That's my issue.
My personal belief is that the cave is neither safe or well suited for this.

[Daedalus]

Guro caver, you are right, a mentor is a great person to show you a cave. You have dived with them before. You know the person. You advance through stages and learn as you grow, just like when you dive with a good cave instructor like your husband.
What they are doing is using the cave to promote an event. They are taking people into Rock Bluff they don't even know. That's my issue.
My personal belief is that the cave is neither safe or well suited for this.

Cindy,

The more you talk about ROCK BLUFF SPRINGS ON THE EAST BANK OF THE SUWANNEE RIVER NEAR BELL, FLORIDA the more people will dive ROCK BLUFF SPRINGS ON THE EAST BANK OF THE SUWANNEE RIVER NEAR BELL, FLORIDA. If you have a problem with traffic to this cave talking about it on the internet is probably not a good idea.

With sidemount becoming increasingly in vogue and manufacturers supplying off the shelf ready to dive sidemount systems (no more need for an experienced sidemount diver to help you build your own rig and do dozens of dives with you to fine tune it before diving in a delicate sidemount cave, just don and dive!) you sidemount divers better start guarding your dive sites more carefully. There are legions of brand new sidemount divers with brand new gear and questionable experience ready to descend on your caves.

Sorry if this sounds N.F.G.O.B. but I would rather have caves that are still in nice condition waiting for people who have the experience and ability to dive them without ruining them for everyone who comes after.

[guru caver]

Guro caver, you are right, a mentor is a great person to show you a cave. You have dived with them before. You know the person. You advance through stages and learn as you grow, just like when you dive with a good cave instructor like your husband.
What they are doing is using the cave to promote an event. They are taking people into Rock Bluff they don't even know. That's my issue.
My personal belief is that the cave is neither safe or well suited for this.

Cindy, I get the impression that you are trying to spare the caves CERTIFIED cave divers!! Am I the only person who sees a bigger problem here?

P.S. you didn't answer that one question about which agency is supporting this 'guide system'. If you don't want to post, would you PM me?

[Sludge]

Cindy, I get the impression that you are trying to spare the caves CERTIFIED cave divers!! Am I the only person who sees a bigger problem here?

Maybe.

There's a sign in one of the shops I work in (an open water-only shop) that says, "Just because you're certified doesn't mean you're qualified."

[Cindy]

Cindy, I get the impression that you are trying to spare the caves CERTIFIED cave divers!! Am I the only person who sees a bigger problem here?

P.S. you didn't answer that one question about which agency is supporting this 'guide system'. If you don't want to post, would you PM me?

Spend 30 seconds of your time not typing me and look up the websites. It would have taken you about 10 seconds since they are on your computer browser. I like you, but I'm done playing with you for today.

[Cindy]

Cindy,

The more you talk about ROCK BLUFF SPRINGS ON THE EAST BANK OF THE SUWANNEE RIVER NEAR BELL, FLORIDA the more people will dive ROCK BLUFF SPRINGS ON THE EAST BANK OF THE SUWANNEE RIVER NEAR BELL, FLORIDA. If you have a problem with traffic to this cave talking about it on the internet is probably not a good idea.

With sidemount becoming increasingly in vogue and manufacturers supplying off the shelf ready to dive sidemount systems (no more need for an experienced sidemount diver to help you build your own rig and do dozens of dives with you to fine tune it before diving in a delicate sidemount cave, just don and dive!) you sidemount divers better start guarding your dive sites more carefully. There are legions of brand new sidemount divers with brand new gear and questionable experience ready to descend on your caves.

Sorry if this sounds N.F.G.O.B. but I would rather have caves that are still in nice condition waiting for people who have the experience and ability to dive them without ruining them for everyone who comes after.

I'm sorry but where in my post did I give the site? I am upset because it is being used and advertised. I feel like I am slipping into a rabbit hole here. Your giving me static for trying to protect a cave? Those caves by the way are in survery's, books, web sites etc. complete with GPS. I didn't even give the city. My objection is that a agency is advertising taking people that sign up at one of their events to the cave. We used to call it the sacred cave. I totally agree with you. Pardon me why I slip back into my rabbit hole and try to understand this post.

[Daedalus]

I'm sorry but where in my post did I give the site? I am upset because it is being used and advertised. I feel like I am slipping into a rabbit hole here. Your giving me static for trying to protect a cave? Those caves by the way are in survery's, books, web sites etc. complete with GPS. I didn't even give the city. My objection is that a agency is advertising taking people that sign up at one of their events to the cave. We used to call it the sacred cave. I totally agree with you. Pardon me why I slip back into my rabbit hole and try to understand this post.

They are taking people into Rock Bluff

Well you mentioned the site name and then mentioned it as a desirable cave to visit. Like you said the caves are easy to find once you know the name. The second component is someone on the internet saying "This is a pretty cave/passage". Once a name is associated with a desirable destination that is when the hordes descend on the site.

I think we are on the same side here. I used to be on the share and share alike side of things but now I am a little surly after having gone back to a few of my favorite places I haven't been in months and finding them completely wrecked.