The Future of Little River and Telford

[Serota]

I only have a minute but found the following list of land acquistion projects on the DEP website and Little R. is in "Group B". I don't have time right now to figure out what Group A versus B is, but thought this would be of interest:

http://www.dep.state.fl.us/lands/acq...0FF%20List.pdf

It does indicate less than fee simple acquisition. I used to do this kind of work for another state's conservation agency and can tell you that being on the list is a long way from anything happening - on the other hand the property has gotten their bureaucration attention.

[Serota]

I can actually spell "bureaucratic", just can't type so well.

[Line Squirrel]

No problems, just access both of them from the river. Then you can do what you want.

That would seem to be the case. But am I not correct that you can't do that at Troy? I've been told that going into the cave there is absolutely forbidden, no matter how you access it. You're not allowed to carry lights or reels in the basin.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

You are right. Since it is the State that owns the spring, then all the land around it is "public" land, including the run. Unlike a private owner, the State can restrict use of public land. Swimming up a run into a State Park would be viewed the same as climbing over the gate.

All the parks I know of have jurisdiction 400ft out from mean high water mark, that, is actually a state law as I understand it. I do not know the chapter and verse but I could find it.

[Serota]

The "Little R." project on DEPs list is in Gadsen County, so it has nothing to do with the spring.

Apologies for jumping the gun!

[aw]

Little River: Yes, it is going be a state park, I don't know if they will ban scooters or not, my guess is that they will, but I sure hope not. What I do know is they will not allow solo diving and that sucks.

Telford: Last I heard SRWMD was "trying" to purchase Telford, they have indeed bought 20something pieces all around Telford. If and when they get Telford, they will most likely turn it over to Parks & Rec. to manage. Again, no solo diving and no 24 hour access which sucks again. I used to dive this very early morning before I opened the shop for Cathy and may start doing the same here in the very near future. On the upside, it will be a safe place to leave your dive vehicle and it will be clean.

Seems to me, prior activities should be grandfathered in if it was already being allowed prior to purchase. That's like the state buying a spring, posting no cave diving cause they think cave diving is dangerous, but just before the purchase, cave diving had been done for decades and decades and decades there. Like sidemount diving - the proof is in the experience. You can't say sidemount diving is an unacceptable form of safe cave diving, because there are many many divers returning from sidemount dives. Same for solo. Same for scootering and not damaging cave.

This cookie-cutter rule mess seems quite retarded when no site-specific regard is given. If the site had been previously closed, and the state bought it to open it up, then GREAT! They can post all the restrictions they want. Just let me in the cave. But don't create a fee-based site when it was originally free and then restrict the level of risk I can personally accept (or no longer be able to scooter where I've scootered hundreds of times - if I owned a scooter).

[Daedalus]

As long as people keep bending ears of local officials about how:
*Those solo divers are insane maniacs and going to get themselves killed!!!
*Those scooter divers are ruining the cave!!!
These things are going to be banned.

I am just an intro diver and less than a year into this sport so my opinion counts very little, but I think as long as people continue to make mountains out of molehills, the state is going to act with a sledgehammer and not a scalpel to solve the issues.

With the new hours that will no doubt be enforced on Little River and Telford the available caves for me to dive other than between 8am and 4pm:
*Ginnie Springs
And that just sucks for people (like me) who like to be able to go diving on weekdays but have little/no availability during banker's hours. I do not solo dive or own a scooter, but I would like to have the opportunity to do so some day. At the rate things seem to be going I will not ever be able to pursue those aspects of the sport as site after site gets closed down with these restrictions.

[aw]

As long as people keep bending ears of local officials about how:
*Those solo divers are insane maniacs and going to get themselves killed!!!
*Those scooter divers are ruining the cave!!!
These things are going to be banned.

I am just an intro diver and less than a year into this sport so my opinion counts very little, but I think as long as people continue to make mountains out of molehills, the state is going to act with a sledgehammer and not a scalpel to solve the issues.

With the new hours that will no doubt be enforced on Little River and Telford the available caves for me to dive other than between 8am and 4pm:
*Ginnie Springs
And that just sucks for people (like me) who like to be able to go diving on weekdays but have little/no availability during banker's hours. I do not solo dive or own a scooter, but I would like to have the opportunity to do so some day. At the rate things seem to be going I will not ever be able to pursue those aspects of the sport as site after site gets closed down with these restrictions.

Well said.

[Cave Ranger]

I'm not sure if I would like Little River to be a State Park or not. Suwannee County already seems to take pretty good care of the site.
TELFORD!!! On the other hand is an absolute pig sty and maybe if the State took that over and kept out the littering drunks and the morons I saw hanging out there looking for a fight last month then maybe that wouldn't be such a bad thing.
It was my first visit to Telford and I was greeted by an giant mound of trash 5 feet from a perfectly good dumpster and bottles in the spring.
Awful...Just awful.

[curtschu]

Why would Little River become a state park? Maybe someone saw the thing that Serota was talking about. It's kinda like Blue Srings..... Which one?

[Kelly Jessop]

As long as people keep bending ears of local officials about how:
*Those solo divers are insane maniacs and going to get themselves killed!!!
*Those scooter divers are ruining the cave!!!
These things are going to be banned.

.

We tell them all the time on forums like this,they read our forums.

As a side note we can probably count on Telford being closed for a year,like Little River was inorder to do control erosion. Take pictures of Telford now,because it will look a lot different when they get done. Also,we probably see access eliminated to Telford and Terrappin sinks.