Public annoucement of line changes

[LMN]

...we went left at what had become a T and circled around to find that someone had cut 25 ft of line back out. Seemed like a pretty ballsy move and I'm glad our team didn't have an issue and then come up on an end of the line expecting a T...

I don't understand, so going in there was a T but not when you came back the other side?! So the line is cut back yet still leaving a T, or is it just back to how it used to be? Because if it's back to how it used to be, one should not come up on an end of the line of a continuous circuit expecting a T since there were none going in.

And speaking of line changes announcements, I heard that the Sweet Passage line in JB is now a continuous circuit, with the line coming from the left being extended and T'd into the line coming from the right, close to the far end, thus obviating the need for a jump reel in the low and silty areas at both ends. I did not verify that.

[pink arrows]

They cut the line but didn't fix the arrows, so it still looked like a T going in. We dropped a cookie on the exit side but didn't look over to make sure the line was intact as it was thr last 8 times I had done the circuit.

To be honest, I don't think there should be Ts in any system. Putting in a jump line diminishes the opportunity for misunderstandings or confusion. But cutting a T out from a place where it actually makes sense just feels like an ego move. I was wondering of the white knight had posted it anywhere or just went for it.

[bamafan]

I disagree about not having any T's. If you make an inadvertent jump you still have a continuous line to the surface. I can certainly see not having T's in the front part of the popular training / tourist caves as jumps need to be practiced and it would ever further restrict intro divers.

[pink arrows]

You're missing the point, brah.

That was a personal opinion on Ts. I was just asking if anyone announced the change anywhere.

[rddvet]

They cut the line but didn't fix the arrows, so it still looked like a T going in. We dropped a cookie on the exit side but didn't look over to make sure the line was intact as it was thr last 8 times I had done the circuit.

To be honest, I don't think there should be Ts in any system. Putting in a jump line diminishes the opportunity for misunderstandings or confusion. But cutting a T out from a place where it actually makes sense just feels like an ego move. I was wondering of the white knight had posted it anywhere or just went for it.

I'm confused. Not being a douche. How did you not see it wasn't a t? Regardless of the arrows if it's a t you'll have 2 lines (mainline and the t line) when you enter. If it's a jump you'll have one(just the mainline). Was there a t on the mainline but on the back end of the circuit that line that came from the mainline was a dead end and from there you had to run line to the end of the circuit?

[nakatomi]

You're missing the point, brah.

That was a personal opinion on Ts. I was just asking if anyone announced the change anywhere.

He didn't miss a point. You stated your opinion and he stated his personal opinion on T's.
For the record I totally agree with him.

As to the reversed T change in Madison, I don't think it was announced here.
For all practical purposes to me it's not a big deal. The line is still continuous even if it is tied off on one end.
Someone getting to that end would at least be able to swim the other way and get to the exit.
So it's probably ok either way (T or jump).

Having T's that are not connected on either side can be a very bad thing, it depends.
I've done an inadvertent jump onto another in very low vis and it could have been fatal.
It ended up being a lost line search 3200' back in the cave in absolute zero viz.
Yes, I know it should not happen but there are circumstances where it can and does in fact happen.

The importance of T'ing in depends on the location of course but some jumps are truly very bad and dangerous.
I have reason to believe that such lines have already led to fatalities and I know of several recent cases that ended up being a close call.

[kensuf]

But are the steps done? Or do you have to get in and out of Martz?

[pink arrows]

I can't think of any gold line Ts in Florida caves that are "very bad and dangerous". Anyway, back to my original point, which has nothing to do with whether or not Ts should exist....

Richard, I drew you an artistic rendition of what the line looked like at the time of my dive. Blue line is the existing line. Green was the line that was there on precious dives but was cut out. The arrow on the side tied off to the rock shouldn't have been there.

None of this matters. It wasn't a big deal. I was just curious about whether or the change was posted since there had been some discussion on this particular spot.

[pink arrows]

Ken, we rappelled directly over the No Jumping sign in the headspring. Rules are very important.

[bamafan]

I would say that many of the gold line T's in the back of JB could be improved. There are several up on the ceiling and the gold line back there is smaller and stained so that the stained T'd in lines look similar especially on a scooter.