Welcome to the Cave Diver's Forum.
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 25
  1. #1

    Default A second Open Letter to Tom Mount and HQ IANTD

    It?s been almost four months since the fatal accident has occured in italian cave Fontanazzi during cave course. Though the accident was well documented and all the diving environment has had an opportunity to asknowledge how unprofessionally the diving during which the diver died, had been planned and run, we still cannot impose IANTD on giving information towards the reasons the instructor has been considered compliant and on why it has been estimated that the instructor had not violated standards, even though it seems obvious that the violation had actually occured.
    Arrogant and bold approach of IANTD HQ, that have been tenaciously refusing giving factual answers and seem to follow the rule: ?it is so because we said so?, that suspends the protesting instructors, that threatens or presses charges on them on ethical basis for having questioned their uncompliant?to-standards decision ? forces us to object even stronger. Sweeping the accident under the carpet means to allow the violation of safety standards amongst the instructors be unpunished, which will unevitably increase the number of such accidents.
    Therefore, if we do not wish this anarchy and crap in our training courses, we have to fight for our rights. There are 126 IANTD divers who have signed the protest by now, but there was 200 who signed the previous one. So, please get acknowledged with the whole story and with the open letter published below , and if your conscience doesn?t let you walk out on it, please stand with us and sign the letter. The incompetent instructor remains fully eligible, while the deceased student is blamed, and we, the instructors, are being threatened and deprived of our qualifications.
    We need the suport of both divers and IANTD instructors from all over the world, because it?s the only way we can be appreciated by IANTD HQ and so the unfair and harmful decision is drawn back. Should this unjustified decision be sustained, this would allow the subsequent standards violations occur, and the fatal accidents would meet no consequences. This will lead further accidents to happen. Please get acknowledged with this letter and broadcast it among all the cave divers and IANTD instructors.
    Krzysztof Starnawski ex IANTD IT instruktor

    https://www.facebook.com/events/1930579140511487/


  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    East of the Mill Pond
    Posts
    1,881

    Default

    Thank you for your courage and very sorry to hear that you got expelled from the agency based on your criticism.
    It has happened to other good people before you.

    I've signed the letter on facebook and I can only encourage other likeminded IANTD divers to do the same.


  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    24,000

    Default

    Here is a link to a report on the accident; http://www.cavediver.net/forum/showt...-Solagna-Italy

    Forrest Wilson (with 2 Rs)
    Any opinions are personal.
    Sump Divers

  4. #4

    Default A second open letter to Tom Mount

    https://www.facebook.com/events/1930579140511487/

    A second Open Letter to Tom Mount dated 22 April 2017.
    We are collecting the signatures below the second Open Letter to Tom Mount.
    Any IANTD diver can submit their signature in the format:
    First name and surname; #IANTD number.
    You can also submit your signature via e-mail: fontanazzi@fontanazziaccident.eu using the same format: First name and surname; #IANTD number.
    Moderator of the site will update the list of people on ongoing basis.

    A second open letter to: Tom Mount, IANTD HQ and the QA Board investigating a fatal accident which took place on January 5th in the Italian cave Fontanazzi.

    Due to the serious traces of negligence of safety rules, good diving practice and IANTD standards while conducting the Cave course during which the trainee Krzysztof Betiuk was tragically exposed to unnecessary risk and eventually died, we request IANTD HQ to suspend the Andrzej Kruczkowski?s instructor?s permissions again and to disclose full justification of the IANTD?s decision.

    1. THE CIRCUMSTANCES OF THE ACCIDENT

    Participants of the cave course:

    Andrzej Kruczkowski - cave instructor ITT IANTD (organizer and course leader)
    Wojciech Nowak ? student on the grade IANTD cave instructor
    Krzysztof Betiuk ? student on the grade cave diver (he died during this course)
    Marcel Korkuś - student on the grade cave diver

    On 05th January a fatal accident occurred during a technical cave course in the Italian cave Fontanazzi. One of the three trainees died after got stuck in a blind, side narrow corridor. The course was led by ITT IANTD Andrzej Kruczkowski. During the same course a cave instructor course was conducted.

    Two days after the accident the candidate for the cave instructor level and participant of this course Wojciech Nowak published the report describing the plan and a sequence of this tragic event (attached below).

    The report stated:
    The trainees were meant to dive alone within 1 minute intervals, starting from the surface through 30 meters narrow vertical funnel with some restriction along the way. They were supposed to meet the leading instructor at 20-meter depth. There was no fixed gold line connecting the surface with the cave. Krzysztof, who were supposed to dive as the third one, entered the wrong way and few meters further got stuck with head down position in the blind, leading to nowhere route.
    This was Krzysztof?s fifth dive during this technical cave course and his fifth cave diving ever. He got stuck so tight that the fourth diver (Wojciech Nowak, the author of the report) who fund him after few minutes was not able to pull him out.
    After a quarter or so when the leading instructor returned from the deeper part of the cave (he was in another part of the cave with another trainee during the accident) he was not able to help either and Krzysztof was already dead.
    Krzysztof?s body was pulled by the emergency services that needed to take out the body using ropes and pull the cadaver with a few rescuers working on the surface.

    2. EXPLANATORY PROCEEDINGS

    Andrzej Kruczkowski officially reported to IANTD HQ similar description of this dive. Apart from that the Board appointed by Tom Mount has received the reports of all others participants confirming Wojciech Nowak?s statement that Andrzej Kruczkowski did not supervise tragically dead Krzysztof Betiuk. Nevertheless, IANTD QA Board found that instructor Andrzej Kruczkowski did not violated IANTD standards either good diving practice.

    QA Board based on the testimony of all witnesses of the accident and where all participants of this tragic dive admitted to leave Krzysztof Betiuk alone in a cave without supervision, which ended with Krzysztof?s death recognized that the instructor IANTD ITT Andrzej Kruczkowski who was the leading instructor and organizer of this course did not violated standards.

    A fragment of the IANTD QA Board statement:

    ?For it is obvious that there had been no standards violation, which was clearly ascertained by QA Board, consisted on the most experienced and ethical ITT cave instructors, we strongly recommend all of the Andrzej Kruczkowski?s qualifications be retained. Andrzej Kruczkowski is to maintain active teaching status on all of the accomplished levels, due to both QA Board and IANTD HQ decision.?

    3. DOUBTS OF THE SYGNATORIES OF THE PROTEST

    Polish IANTD Instructors have protested this IANTD QA Board?s decision.
    In assessing the violation of standards, the signatories were based on an internal IANTD order.

    Standards valid on the day of the accident: THE INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF NITROX AND TECHNICAL DIVERS? (IAND, INC. dba IANTD?) STANDARDS AND PROCEDURES MANUAL FOR RECREATIONAL DIVING INCLUSIVE OF SPORT AND TECHNICAL DIVING Revised: 7/7/2010 ? updated March 2015.

    Thorough analysis of the standards and honest evaluation of good diving practise leaves no doubt that during the course the standards were not complied in following aspects:

    1. The instructor Andrzej Kruczkowski has planned the dive where trainees were expected to dive alone through a difficult bit of a cave only with a line partially laid without supervision. And so, this dive was conducted.

    2. Trainee Krzysztof Betiuk was in side mount configuration to which he was not certified, not to even mention multistage SM. Krzysztof Betiuk had at least three side cylinders (one with air, one with nitrox and one with oxygen) during the dive.

    3. The ITT Andrzej Kruczkowski had instructor technical cave IT qualifications despite a reasonable suspicion that he did not meet the requirements to obtain such a degree. Andrzej Kruczkowski has completed the IANTD instructor training in August 2011 and in 2014 he became cave IT despite a reasonable suspicion that he did not meet the requirements. As early as 2015 Andrzej Kruczkowski was nominated for ITT by Tom Mount.

    4. There is a reasonable suspicion that student Wojciech Nowak did not meet the requirements to join the cave instructor course which he participated when the accident had place.

    5. ?Intro the cave? part was performed in the cave too difficult to do so due to several restrictions on the entry part, that make it impossible to attend more than one person at the time.
    All the issues mentioned above had a direct impact on the Krzysztof Betiuk?s fatal accident to occur.

    4. DIVERS SOCIETY VS. IANTD HQ

    From the e-mail correspondence between IANTD HQ and signatories it follows that:

    ? IANTD HQ rejected the request, issued by six IT to re-examine the circumstances of the accident. In the application, the signatories pointed out all the issues suggesting that the standards of cave training conducted by Andrzej Kruczkowski were violated. Because of this violations Krzysztof Betiuk, a twenty nine year old participant of this course, died.
    ? IANTD QA Board, assigned by Tom Mount, to assess the circumstances of the accident, has consisted of the people identified by Tom Mount as the most competent and experienced. Because members of the board remain anonymous, their actual experience cannot be assessed, nor do they remain free from pressure from IANTD HQ to cover up the case.
    ? In the absence of a response from the IANTD authorities on a written protest, an open letter was issued and signed by 2 ITT, 5 IT, 34 instructors and 153 divers.
    In the response to the open letter, members of the organization, including the signatories of the protest, were informed of an immediate tightening of ethical standard on public speaking in the media on the events of January 5, 2017.
    Thus, IANTD members were obliged to keep silent under the threat of consequences from the IANTD authorities.

    It was seven IT instructors among the signatories of the open letter:
    Sebastian Popek, Łukasz Pi?rewicz, Marek Cacaj, Krzysztof Starnawski, Tomasz Żabierek, Roman Virt and Sylwester Peknik.

    Sebastian Popek, Łukasz Pi?rewicz and Marek Cacaj were informed, that their IT qualifications would be maintained only if they adhere to the new IANTD ethical standards, which bans negative public speaking in the social media concerning any instructor, instructors? actions and the IANTD organization itself.

    Tomasz Żabierek was immediately deprived of his IT qualifications.

    Roman Virt, the ITT Instructor, who first informed Tom Mount about irregularities during conducting the course where Krzysztof Betiuk died, yesterday on 18th Apr received a letter informing about immediate removal from the IANTD.

    Krzysztof Starnawski, who owns an e-mail account from which signatories have sent protest, was reported by Tom Mount to the Disciplinary Board of IANTD to verify his ethical behavior. The breach of ethical standards would have supposed to concern the correspondence between Krzysztof Starnawski and Tom Mount where Krzysztof Starnawski called on Tom Mount to re-examine the case and to suspend the qualifications of Andrzej Kruczkowski until the circumstances of the accident and the investigation of the prosecution were completed.

    Jacek Lubowiecki has been the only IT, who has revoked the protest. As a reward, he has been given a lead of Polish IANTD office starting from the 01st June 2017.

    The current situation forces us to question not only the IANTD QA Board?s reliability, but also the doubts about the moral attitudes of Tom Mount and other members of the IANTD Board.
    Leaving this at the current stage will be a green light for all IANTD instructors allowing for impunity for safety violations which will inevitably result in further fatal accidents.

    Therefore, if you share our opinion, then please sign up under this statement (it is enough to enter your name and certificate number and the position: IANTD instructor or IANTD diver).
    If we do not stop this pathology in our organization tomorrow it might impact each one of you as well.

    1. Krzysztof Starnawski IT IANTD#3967
    2. Adam Leslie INSTRUKTOR IANTD#8203
    3. Radosław Zajkowski INSTRUKTOR IANTD#7343
    4. Hubert Grzybek INSTRUKTOR IANTD#9025
    5. Robert Prince Pawłowski INSTRUKTOR IANTD#8414
    6. Tomasz Trojanowicz INSTRUKTOR IANTD#7724
    7. Tymek Podg?rczyk INSTRUKTOR IANTD#7779
    8. Leszek Gimel IANTD INSTRUKTOR IANTD#9534
    9. Rafał Łakomski INSTRUKTOR IANTD#8670
    10. Wojtek Komocki INSTRUKTOR IANTD#9092
    11. Massimiliano Canossa INSTRUKTOR IANTD#2549 Italy
    12. Paweł Gałecki INSTRUKTOR IANTD#9062
    13. Jarek Kur INSTRUKTOR IANTD#5068
    14. Mariusz Wr?bel INSTRUKTOR IANTD#8323
    15. Magdalena Saugut INSTRUKTOR IANTD#9435
    16. Tomasz Wci?rka IANTD#171925
    17. Marek Łapiński IANTD#174809
    18. Robert Much IANTD#161698 IANTD#142061
    19. Gerard Maj IANTD#131398
    20. Piotr Zadrowski IANTD#169011
    21. Tomasz Zapi?r IANTD#171917
    22. Paweł Zapi?r IANTD#171918
    23. Izabela Rynkiewicz IANTD#169112
    24. Grzegorz Świątnicki IANTD#186027
    25. Ewa Kruk IANTD#165798
    26. Michał Marek IANTD#165121
    27. Monika Kurzep IANTD#165608
    28. Grażyna Mikulewicz IANTD#164529
    29. Katerina Peknik IANTD#108020
    30. Marcin Jastrzębski IANTD#140110
    31. Oliver J. Albrecht IANTD#146824
    32. Ryszard Wolschendorf IANTD#4047
    33. Sławek Paćko IANTD#111865
    34. Anna Rapp IANTD#62803
    35. Stanisław Janicki IANTD#179622
    36. Sebastian Bodnar IANTD#162800
    37. Robert Gruca IANTD#113186
    38. Aleksandra Gruca #113187
    39. Rafał Rutkowski IANTD#83755
    40. Piotr Krych IANTD#169570
    41. Paweł Boruta IANTD#167237
    42. Katarzyna Leszczyńska IANTD#170146
    43. Mateusz Filipp IANTD#97056
    44. Sebastian Prędki IANTD#118090
    45. Paweł Seweryniuk IANTD#185064
    46. Paniczko Sławomir IANTD#110072
    47. Anna Bocheńska IANTD#160942
    48. Michał Gignal IANTD#60052
    49. Agata Isajew, IANTD#176130
    50. Tomasz Siwy IANTD#115540
    51. David Zaras IANTD#162137
    52. Tomasz Jeżewski IANTD#163700
    53. Łukasz Potyra IANTD#77363
    54. Jarek Matyga IANTD#171593
    55. Agata Wiesiołek IANTD#173621
    56. Radosław Bieliński IANTD#110070
    57. Robert Goszczyński IANTD #121299
    58. Adam Borkowski IANTD#122196
    59. Maciej Jarząbek IANTD#175712
    60. Sebastian Wąsowicz IANTD#160888
    61. Krzysztof Rejer CCR IANTD#173536
    62. Bartosz Ciomcia IANTD#144591
    63. Michał Stańko IANTD#175607
    64. Ania Ciura IANTD#170195
    65. Krzysztof Burza IANTD#100885
    66. Michał Winek IANTD#82975
    67. Katarzyna Kapłan IANTD#82571
    68. Łukasz Lechowicz IANTD#67572
    69. Michał Gwiżdż IANTD#119299
    70. Andrzej Piekarski IANTD#179215
    71. Tomasz Machalski IANTD#82529
    72. Rafał Duda IANTD#184933
    73. Maciej Bulkowski IANTD#163668
    74. Aneta Porada IANTD#173435
    75. Jarosław Kwiatkowski IANTD#136357
    76. Jowita Kozana IANTD#118014
    77. Stanislaw Krzeptowski - Sabała IANTD#138648
    78. Grzegorz Chimiak IANTD#170200
    79. Zbigniew Żytkowiak IANTD#185991
    80. Izabela Kruk IANTD#179112
    81. Daniel Ostrowski IANTD#161993
    82. Tomasz Michura IANTD#130454
    83. Adam Seweryn IANTD#101720
    84. Małgorzata Machalska IANTD#85238
    85. Łukasz Bulsiewicz IANTD#178648
    86. Bartek Witul IANTD#170082
    87. Jacek Mazur IANTD#176316
    88. Andrzej Holka IANTD#119594
    89. Tomasz Czubkowski IANTD#169568
    90. Izabela Kącka IANTD#185046
    91. Dariusz Bułka IANTD#116700
    92. Maciek Ogrodnik IANTD#170199
    93. Małgorzata Barańska IANTD#136364
    94. Bartłomiej Kamiński IANTD#161712
    95. Michał Leszczyński IANTD#170147
    96. Michał Piekarewicz IANTD#186434
    97. Ryszard Gmiter IANTD#108047
    98. Krzysztof Puciaty IANTD#16654
    99. Robert Karaszewski IANTD#176869
    100. Dariusz Dynarzewski IANTD#8002
    101. Adam Jaworski IANTD#160900
    102. Jarek Macedoński IANTD#170198
    103. Monika Ławrynowicz IANTD#117622
    104. Paweł Dubiel IANTD#162780
    105. Gracjan Stec IANTD #164535
    106. Tomasz W?jcik IANTD#77825
    107. Robert Malinowski IANTD#175731
    108. Tomek Dąbrowa IANTD#119300
    109. Jacek Kapczuk IANTD#164475
    110. Irena Gilwatowska IANTD#165166
    111. Emilian Stęchlicki IANTD#178746
    112. Krzysztof Ślusarczyk IANTD#185065
    113. Tomasz Płociński IANTD#119541
    114. Marcin Tracz IANTD#178725
    115. Tomek Rzepecki IANTD#108861
    116. Marcin Kr?lik IANTD#176212
    117. Chrystian Przybylski IANTD#99122
    118. Jacek Marek IANTD#170086
    119. Artur Mielcarek IANTD #144637
    120. Konrad Małek IANTD#176127
    121. Rafał Tomaszewski IANTD#176129
    122. Gabriela Gr?zlov? IANTD#135067
    123. Agnieszka Bariatien IANTD#178640
    124. Piotr Łoś IANDT#161718
    125. Paweł Nowacki IANTD#138519
    126. Konrad Stachowicz IANTD#171933
    127. Jezzy Wo IANTD#???
    128. Zbigniew Zborowski IANTD#???
    129. Victoria Iwanowska IANTD#???
    130. Marcin Jamkowski IANTD#???

    Dominican Republic Speleological Society
    http://dr-ss.com
    Aquavista Films LLC.
    http://www.aquavistafilms.com

  5. #5

    Default

    What IANTD is doing is downright dishonest, threat of expulsion etc... to any INTD instructor who speaks out about safety if it reflects negatively on the agency. In this case like the recent gran cenote one facts were hoped to be pushed aside, downplayed and forgotten about when instructors are clearly at fault.
    I just do not understand why INTD cannot uphold safety standards and act accordingly instead of always trying to cover it up, a and now an official new rule is put in place that any INTD instructor who speaks about, posts or makes public any information that reflects in a negative way on INTD will be terminated from INTD, this is an attempt at making it easier for management to cover up and wrongdoings.

    I forgot a letter or I guess my post will be removed....

    Dominican Republic Speleological Society
    http://dr-ss.com
    Aquavista Films LLC.
    http://www.aquavistafilms.com

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    High Springs, FL
    Posts
    1,142

    Default

    I LOVE the explanation, since he wasn't being supervised and was left alone, the instructor is not responsible.
    It could be that keeping students alive isn't one of the "standards".

    You'all seem pretty heated about it, why not just go teach for another agency or form a new one?


  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    East of the Mill Pond
    Posts
    1,881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mdax View Post
    You'all seem pretty heated about it, why not just go teach for another agency or form a new one?
    Because students are getting killed? In caves?

    And I'm sure we all agree that we don't want that.
    It's kind of warped to see how people make a stink when a scooter is used in twin caves or some of the silt in the subway tunnel gets relocated. Yet when students perish in a class it's business as usual and the instructors can keep on teaching.
    And no, this is not only one single agency doing it. Just look at last year's fatality during a cave class in Blue Grotto. That instructor is with another agency and still teaching as well.

    Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Panama City Beach, Fl.
    Posts
    1,864

    Default

    I wonder if the girl from Blue Grotto got turned into immigration like Steve Lewis did? If she did she should receive a 5 year ban from coming into the US also.

    Most of the agencies only care about the money. It seems to me that IANTD is one of the worst. They keep waving the magic wand and handing out instructor cards to just about anyone who can make a buck for them. The only way I see the issue getting resolved is for the agency to get sued when someone dies and it is proven that their instructor never completed any of the prerequisites to actually become an instructor. Nearly every agency is guilty of this as once you get blessed by your buddy at one agency you can crossover to the other agencies with often times little effort if you bs them. Don't worry though the CDS is removing gold line T's from 300' deep caves a couple thousand feet back because that was the only gold line T in North Florida. The industry is really in bad shape and sadly very few seem to really care. There are a few instructors who are speaking out but most won't because all they care about is making a buck.


  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    High Springs, FL
    Posts
    1,142

    Default

    I agree, if you are lying about taxes or killing people in caves you should be banned from coming to the U.S.
    I think it's hilarious that folks who have come here without paying taxes have been punted. I thought the whole orange lunatic in charge would have no positive effect...guess i was wrong on that count.

    I also agree the best way to address this is tort/courts, however I'm not sure it will really change anything.

    The reason this crap happens is because cave diving is the "pinnacle" of diving in many peoples minds and they want to prove how "elite" they are....without actually doing anything special.
    MANY instructors, including most of those posting here do not really fail people on any regular frequency.

    Teaching technical and cave diving is super profitable, it will attract scumbags for the rest of time.


  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    1,225

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by phillip1 View Post
    What IANTD is doing is downright dishonest, threat of expulsion etc... to any INTD instructor who speaks out about safety if it reflects negatively on the agency. In this case like the recent gran cenote one facts were hoped to be pushed aside, downplayed and forgotten about when instructors are clearly at fault.
    I just do not understand why INTD cannot uphold safety standards and act accordingly instead of always trying to cover it up, a and now an official new rule is put in place that any INTD instructor who speaks about, posts or makes public any information that reflects in a negative way on INTD will be terminated from INTD, this is an attempt at making it easier for management to cover up and wrongdoings.
    The worst of it is the secondary consequences out of such behavior.
    Those ITTs, ITs and instructors who actually care about safety and upholding high standards, are the ones that speak out and as result get kicked out, revoked or leave for themselves..
    Who is left? All those who care less and with that naturally goes the degradation of skills..
    And all why? Because of money and the fear of litigation on an institutional level, when such behavior actually is rather opening the agency to such litigation..



 

Similar Threads

  1. WTB: IANTD Sidemount No Mount Student Workbook
    By moody in forum Gear Exchange
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-25-2013, 05:01 PM
  2. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 08-16-2012, 09:09 AM
  3. An open letter to Ginnie Management
    By aainslie in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-12-2008, 08:49 AM
  4. Tom Mount - NSS-CDS Workshop Speaker of the Week
    By Bill Rotella in forum Cave Diving Events, Socials, Workshops
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-13-2008, 11:15 AM
  5. A letter to the open water diving community from the NACD
    By Walter Pickel in forum Main Forum
    Replies: 32
    Last Post: 05-03-2007, 10:18 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts