The meaning of arrows

[RN]

I was taught side passages are typically marked according to popularity and size and have seen what I was taught in actual practice in most caves, but not all. I teach the same to my students with the caveat that not all caves will be in compliance. It seems that not all cave divers are taught the same thing and, in fact, I'm seeing line arrows pop up in various places where they really don't belong. This is occurring in caves where there are no line committees so deferring to a committee isn't the answer.

So what I was taught is

2 line arrows typically indicate a popular side passage that is also large enough to accommodate more than 1 team of divers. If a jump spool is already in place between the arrows it's still okay to tie in your own jump spool to one of the arrows and continue on with your dive plan to take that passage.

1 line arrow typically indicates a less popular side passage that is usually only large enough to accommodate 1 team. If there's already a jump spool in place then fall back on plan B.

0 line arrows at a side passage indicates not so popular side passage or one that could be small and/or delicate. In this case the team deploys their own arrow to tie onto and removes it when they leave.


This seems to be the common practice in the High Springs and Luraville caves. You can easily give someone directions to various side passages by telling them to go to the 2nd set of double arrows or 1st set of double arrows after the Park Bench, etc.

Recently in Jackson Blue I'm seeing arrows and even double arrows popping up all over the gold line and in places that do not fit the descriptions provided above. Maybe it's because these divers aren't aware of how arrows have been traditionally used. Or maybe what I was taught has become a thing of the past.


What were you taught?

[whodunit68]

What were you taught?

I may not provide a ton of value here since you were the one who taught me but what I can do is reiterate that through the rest of my training, the same "policies" or "procedures" were taught to me. Essentially, the only thing either I don't remember or wasn't taught was the size of the passage was related to the number of arrows but I was taught that 2 arrows (and the tie-in procedure you mentioned) was for a popular jump, a single arrow is for less popular, and no arrow may be for one that is being protected or is small or isn't popular or is technically difficult, there is no arrow. Again, I learned the same tie-in procedure.

[TraceMalin]

What you said, Rob, as general rule of thumb if you aren't familiar enough with the tunnel to say, "Well, it depends ..."

[FW]

It also depends on what country. In Mexico, there are double arrows pointing to the nearest exit/air in some systems with multiple exits.

[Kelly Jessop]

2 line arrows typically indicate a popular side passage that is also large enough to accommodate more than 1 team of divers. If a jump spool is already in place between the arrows it's still okay to tie in your own jump spool to one of the arrows and continue on with your dive plan to take that passage.

1 line arrow typically indicates a less popular side passage that is usually only large enough to accommodate 1 team. If there's already a jump spool in place then fall back on plan B.

0 line arrows at a side passage indicates not so popular side passage or one that could be small and/or delicate. In this case the team deploys their own arrow to tie onto and removes it when they leave.

Rob,there is so much variety. There are tourist caves in different locations that have their own set of "rules" for line arrow placement,and even then you will find inconsistency within the same system. Having a reel/spool at a jump is not indicative of a person being there because 1)they could be setting up a traverse 2)leaving it there to return the next day(s). If it is a passage that can only accomodate 1 team,then I use the approach that is used at Madison for Rocky Horror,which place something on the line denoting I am here.

A bigger concern that I have with line arrows used to mark jumps,is the training that people receive on using line arrows. I have seen several discussions on Scubaboard with newer cave divers and there seems to be several schools of thought. Use a line arrow 1) mark the direction you have traveled for your own exit out 2) mark it pointing to the closest known exit. The danger I see here is that you have line arrows that can conflict with other line arrows on the line,because in a silt out there is really no difference between the personal line arrows versus permanent line arrows that they are being taught. I encountered this not too long ago when I saw a jump from crossover to P1/Olsen line,there were line arrows on the gold line and jump line directing me to Peanut tunnel side,which stood in conflict with the yellow line arrows point to Olsen 150' away.

[FW]

...A bigger concern that I have with line arrows used to mark jumps,is the training that people receive on using line arrows. I have seen several discussions on Scubaboard with newer cave divers and there seems to be several schools of thought. Use a line arrow 1) mark the direction you have traveled for your own exit out 2) mark it pointing to the closest known exit. The danger I see here is that you have line arrows that can conflict with other line arrows on the line,because in a silt out there is really no difference between the personal line arrows versus permanent line arrows that they are being taught. I encountered this not too long ago when I saw a jump from crossover to P1/Olsen line,there were line arrows on the gold line and jump line directing me to Peanut tunnel side,which stood in conflict with the yellow line arrows point to Olsen 150' away.

That is the main reason the cookie was invented.

[Kelly Jessop]

That is the main reason the cookie was invented.

Be it clothes pin or cookie,nondirectional markers are very important. Going back to what Rob is questioning,some standardization of line arrows in systems,we also have failures in standardization of teaching line arrow placement. All it takes is one wrong line arrow placement by someone following a set of rules that are incorrect,and another team exiting rapidly due to an emergency,to have a catastrophic situation (which unfortunately has already happened).

[OFG-1]

I was taught that you had to put your name or initials on them, and then spread them all over hell and breakfast so everyone would know you were there. Since I like to stay low key, I just put "Trey" or "JJ" on all of mine.

[Bobby]

Some time between 2000 - 2005 Larry had asked me to help with writing new guidelines. Back then we had many discussions regarding the various jump line protocols that were being taught and used. In the end the committee decided that it was too much change and left it to the instructor as it had always been. I no longer have the work as it was many computers and backups ago however this is an issue that, IMHO, the agencies should all get in line with the same training. Teaching someone to place an arrow that goes against the permanent arrows pointing to the nearest exit, regardless of the direction they came from, is dangerous and setting up a strong opportunity for confusion. Back then we came up with a system of using our line to mark the direction we came from on a non-directional marker. 10-15 years later we still have the same conflicts in training and protocol.

[twaldo]

Back then we came up with a system of using our line to mark the direction we came from on a non-directional marker. 10-15 years later we still have the same conflicts in training and protocol.

Having JUST seen my first set of back to back arrows, I actually thought about a cookie on MY side just so there was NO confusion as to which was was out.... I'm sure as I get more comfortable in Peacock (or what ever cave) this wouldn't be as much an issue... but it's nice to know that I wasn't the first one to consider it and will now be more likely to do it.

And to Rob's original post... < < is what I was taught for a jump.... Don't remember single arrows being said to be anything more than footage markers at every 100' but then I'm only Cave1 and that probably wasn't something I was supposed to know yet, but wouldn't have been hard to figure out.


Tim