Trashing the caves, do you not feel any shame?

[stickydeco]

As previously stated, "Do you not feel any shame?" Obviously, the same Douchbag who had the "complete absence of diving skills" at the JB, then came over to Devil's and left usins a tasty present this past week. Looks like he might also possess a "complete absence" of Social Skills too. A juicy, sticky, condom cath and a huge piched loaf, all rolled-up in a wet Depends. Right there on the floor for all to see and step on. Cute. Real cute. It's no wonder that Ginnie Management puts all of us Cave Types in the category of "Difficult Persons."








This Dickwad turned Ginnie into an EPA Superfund site.

[gsxr1997]

I can tell you from firsthand experience that posting gopro videos of others acting like strokes in caves does not bode well for the poster........

[Benthic]

I can't believe I'm going to say this...but here goes.

Does it really matter? Don't get me wrong, like the OP when I see SPG drag marks, hand prints, fin prints, and the like on the cave floor it makes my blood boil. I ask myself many of the same questions that other posters in this thread have already mentioned. I wonder what the individual was thinking, how in the world they got a cave card to begin with, and if they're aware of what they've done or not. I'd absolutely love it if we could find a way to get these sorts of things under control.

But when it comes to cave conservation I'm not sure that the elimination of "squirrel tracks" is really where our focus should be. While I agree that they shouldn't be tolerated, I think that the level of water flow in the aquifer and the quality of that water (nitrate levels, dissolved oxygen levels, etc) is of FAR greater concern. Again, I'm not saying that contact damage is permissible. But for my money, I might be willing to allow divers to get negative and walk through caves if it would solve the aquifer recharge and nitrate level issues we're currently seeing all over the state.

Squirrel tracks definitely piss me off but decreased flow, nitrate spikes and algae blooms scare the hell out of me. I wonder if the battle against squirrel tracks is the equivalent of rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

Brian

[nakatomi]

I wonder if the battle against squirrel tracks is the equivalent of rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

I can't help but agree that you do have a point there.

[Jack Hammer]

The trouble with tolerating "squirrel marks" is that most likely divers who are unable to avoid hitting the bottom are also likely to be be hitting and damaging most the rest of the cave too...

Sent via

[Ben M]

Brian, that I'd what I was going after but the meaning didn't quite make it out.

[Garth]

I'm thinking that runaway scooter trail in JB tops my list as the most outstanding diver inflicted damage I've ever seen.
That being said the amount of damage going up Hill 400 double lines ect is phenomenal, not to say it really got bad with the advent with the sidemount fad (Its a tool not a statement) but how can all the broken bits of rock strewn on the floor ever be repaired?

During my cave course we were constantly reminded of trim, buoyancy and cave conservation with the understanding that touching anything other than a solid rock was a never event. This was earlier this year but I had been thinking about cave diving for quit some time, looking at film, and trying to grasp what it takes. I was astonished when I was finally able to dive in a cave and to see the horrible damage on the cave floor up hill 400 it made me sad.

The quiet of the rebreather always gives me a calm feeling as I observe the environment around me but when we came to this it was disturbing. I saw scratches, gouges, and even what looked to be hand prints from a clawing on the bottom.

Humans can be destructive if they are not aware. I certainly learned about cave conservation in my cave course, by my instructor who constantly was discussing it and by the horrific images I saw. There was certainly a lot of beauty in the caves though which will have me itching to return over and over.

I hope the OP is able to make a difference and I support all his efforts along with the others involved.

Thanks
Garth

[math]

As previously stated, "Do you not feel any shame?" Obviously, the same Douchbag who had the "complete absence of diving skills" at the JB, then came over to Devil's and left usins a tasty present this past week. Looks like he might also possess a "complete absence" of Social Skills too. A juicy, sticky, condom cath and a huge piched loaf, all rolled-up in a wet Depends. Right there on the floor for all to see and step on. Cute. Real cute. It's no wonder that Ginnie Management puts all of us Cave Types in the category of "Difficult Persons."

This Dickwad turned Ginnie into an EPA Superfund site.

I cannot help but laugh hysterically at this - alas, my maturity may be showing. I'm sorry, but some divers are sometimes so disgusting all I can do is laugh. I routinely hike back to Buford when I go for a walk out there. Almost every time I'm there, I pick up a ridiculous amount of trash, some left by divers, some not. I have a special folder of photos, because sometimes people leave things there that I simply won't pick up. I pick up almost everything, but there's just a limit to what one man can stomach in a given day. These photos would definitely have ended up in my gallery. I even find trash very deep in the woods out there (possibly blown in by wind) - including a jon boat, slowly deteriorating in the middle of that great vast swamp. By the way, stop leaving your shoes at the gate, and stop carving the word "BUFORD" into it, too.

And wash your hands.

[nakatomi]

I can tell you from firsthand experience that posting gopro videos of others acting like strokes in caves does not bode well for the poster........

I checked the passages again yesterday and here is just a little Gopro footage. This is not all of the damage, just some of the more impressive imprints.
As you may notice, there are several marks cause by a scooter in this video, a few of them with what looks like prop marks.

[Jason.knepper]

Oliver, can we see the footage?