Pre-Crime Alert.

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The locked thread was not uncivil (macleod). It may have been previously. but to lock a thread that "Many feel ... will become uncivil" ??

many? really? and they can tell the future? and so the thread is locked, just in case it might in the future violate the "civility" rule? I didn't realize the civility rule applied to the possibility of a future violation and that some when some unknown poll should "many" think "it might become" uncivil, then that's sufficient to close it.

I call BS on that. I think it's not the many, but the few, even perhaps the one. Why don't the rules just say that whenever the owner of the forum doesn't like something he/she can shut it down and can give the same power to whomever he/she chooses?

I'm probably censored now... but I know how to change my IP address...heh-heh.

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I'm locking this thread and any more on the subject. Many feel the topic has, is, and will become uncivil. There is a clear rule on that.
Tom Johnson / tj
Administrator/Sponsor
Cave & Technical Instructor/IT, TDI, NSS CDS, NACD, IANTD, ERDI, SDI, PADI
Dayo Scuba
Orlando, Florida

[Lamar English]

+1.

[MK7]

I call BS on that. I think it's not the many, but the few, even perhaps the one. Why don't the rules just say that whenever the owner of the forum doesn't like something he/she can shut it down and can give the same power to whomever he/she chooses?

Do you own the forum? Do you pay the bills? If not, I say go start your own forum. (Which is more polite than STFU.)

[MichaelAngelo]

If I had a Ban Hammer
I'd ban hammer in the morning
I'd ban hammer in the evening
All over cave land
I'd ban hammer out danger
I'd ban hammer out warning
I'd ban hammer out uncivilly
I'd ban hammer out love between my cave brother and cave sister
Allll over cave lannnnd

If I had a ban hammer
I'd ban Hamm........

This ban hammer song has need closed due to possible future litigation by Peter, Paul and some Mary

[tj]

The locked thread was not uncivil

Unfortunately I don't share that opinion. I think it is a continuation of an earlier thread that was 'ruled' uncivil. I hardly ever 'moderate' (or express my 'opinion'), but I do put my foot down (or in it) now and then. . .

[speleodiver]

And people wonder why the cave diving community is full of drama. It's all about bending the rules to suit your own personal needs.

Sorry guys but if you think locking a thread will stop the issue from boiling to the surface, you are wrong. Locking it only opens the flood gates for inquiring minds. It's how that slogan became so popular and why they sell millions of copies of completely fictious pile of crap and garbage. You see, if you push something hard enough or have a pulpit to preach from then the weak minded will always believe.

My suggestion is change the "rules" to reflect the rules but also state that the rules will be modified to accomindate any undocumented opinion of any moderator who feels the threat of a perceived violation whether it occurs or not having no revelancy on the decision. Basically a guilty before your proven innocent situation.

As for me, I don't need CDF or any other forum to find the truth. I simply just go get it through the intense research personally conducted. CDF is not a court, many people need to learn that. Most posts are gossip and someone's informed guess as to the issue raised. I guess what I am saying is it is a low rate circus due to an over whelming majority of uneducated folks who like to preach from thousands of miles away about posts they know nothing about as if it makes them more popular or somehow more intelligent. It doesn't. The fact is, the truth will always come out. Not on here of course but in the real world. One thing I can assure you is the truth will come out regardless of how much you think you can hide it, twist it up or bury it deep in a unmarked grave.

As for any information that may refute the current information being circulated, get it circulating if you feel so strongly about it affecting the outcome of what is certainly going to hit the public attention very soon. Talk is cheap but an actual court document is not. The posting about a settlement is correct. However, most all court cases settled without trial are done so because enough discovery has been performed to draw a conclusion of a strong case for one side or the other. Yes, insurance companies do settle to avoid costly litigation but many times this is not after thousands of dollars have been spent on discovery and depositions unless there is high porbability the out ome is not favorable. They simply look at the case and make a decision on a percieved threat of a loss. Sort of like when threads are locked on here.

One last word of advice, if you have something to hide or if you don't, sitting on, seeking a position on or getting anywhere around a board position will naturally draw attention to you. More so if you have been involved in an accident or scandal. After all this is the cave diving community where there are those who strive to be something they will never be and those that think board positions are a steeping stone in a popularity contest. The truth is boards have become over run by those that do not want the job but rather the fame. This makes it impossible for the ones sitting for the work to perfom such and exactly why most boards don't function together at all. Too many personal agendas and no room for compromise. If any board Member of any organization has anything they are hiding, I suggest you step down, stay out of the limelight your so desire because it is the very evil that will surface what you are hiding because it is the nature of the beast in the cave diving world to attack the popular with or without merit and in reality only those with no skeletons in the closet will survive. It's basic politics 101.

Good luck to all and may the truth set you free from the bonds of shame or show the world you are the real deal with a heart of gold.

This is all for me as I sign off from CDF and get back to reality. Please feel free to lock my post, ban me or hang me on the court house lawn for any precieved rule violation that may follow from my opinion which is solicited within the same rules.

[Squirrel Girl]

And people wonder why the cave diving community is full of drama. It's all about bending the rules to suit your own personal needs.

Personally, I disagree. I think it's about people with strong opinions and many of these people demanding others think the same way they do, whatever that position might be. Just my perspective.

Sorry guys but if you think locking a thread will stop the issue from boiling to the surface, you are wrong. Locking it only opens the flood gates for inquiring minds.

There are moderators who make this very point when discussing how to manage the forum.

This is all for me as I sign off from CDF and get back to reality.

I think that's a very good idea, for all of us. IMHO, the internet can feel more real than reality, but it's not.

[Jack Hammer]

Macleods thread asked anyone interested to PM him for details and was locked at his request to avoid becoming the mess earlier threads had turned to. I dont have a dog to enter either way in the local cave politics pony show. How can a thread that no one is able to post in become uncivil? o_O Are we moderating PMs now?

Sent via flying butt monkies using Tapatalk 2

[mstueven]

I often joke that you should never mess up the truth with a bunch of facts. Censorship of this kind breeds theories of collusion even where there is none. It certainly begs the question of who we are trying to protect, and brings out the inquisitive side of people.

Personally, I just want to visit cave country as often as I can so that I can dive in spectacular underwater caves with some equally spectacular people. But I hate politics, so this kind of drama is a bit of a turn off to those of us who don't live there and see this as our window to your world. Remember that the CDF is a billboard for divers interested in learning about cave diving. It won't look good with graffiti all over it.

[MichaelAngelo]

Locking, locking, locking the the threads.
Keep them moderators locking the threads.
No need to understand them, just post, slam and ban em.
Speculation will be running high.
Post em in, lock em out, post em in, lock em out
Moderation!