TDI Full Cave???

[kieren]

I have a question and I know I could ask a TDI instructor but thought others might like to know the answer also. When a diver takes full cave using a rebreather will the card they receive be unit specific?


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the card does not specify the unit. However, per standards the instructor must be an instructor on the unit being used for training.

[Kthompso]

I recently took all of my cave certification courses through TDI. My progression went from Cavern, Intro to Cave and then Full Cave. I consider my Full Cave an accomplishment, but not a means to an end. Instead I was instructed that my Full Cave was a license to learn without the direct supervision of an Instructor, but to strongly consider diving with an experienced mentor.

I initially did not want to get certified through TDI. I learned in my own way that the certifying agency is less important than a good instructor. I found NACD, NSS-CDS, TDI and IANTD to all be good agencies with the same goals at the time of certification. Which is to make sure that you have the proper skills to continue your cave diving education without the direct supervision of an Instructor.

Talk to instructors, ask a lot of questions, and don't get too hung up on the certifying agency. A lot of instructors are certified to teach through multiple agencies and may be able to teach you with a specific agency if you are that concerned. This is your diving progression and you are going to be spending a lot of money to do it. Don't be afraid to ask for an potential instructors time to answer some questions.

Good luck in your cave diving progression

[RN]

I think fixed-term certifications are good for many things, for example all diving certs! Rescue ought to expire, for example. It could be renewed by helping out with another Rescue class.
My original ham radio license had a one-year expiration, thus good incentive to upgrade.

I dived Apprentice for a year, got a lot of practice, but still took Full before I felt ready....and in fact I was not ready. Re-up'ed the Apprentice, then finally was ready.
During my Apprentice dives, the restrictions were mostly adhered to...
One comment, for those of us who have to integrate diving with work, and travel a fair distance to get to caves, one year is not much time or many dives.

I see that more of an issue for Intro Cave than Apprentice. One of the main reasons for this, I believe, is because many divers take AN/DP between Intro and Apprentice. This can take some time and money and a year or year and a half might not be enough. I have reissued some intro cave certifications. The new NACD standards will have Intro Cave expire after 24 months for this reason. Apprentice will remain at 12 months for now.

[tursiops]

I see that more of an issue for Intro Cave than Apprentice. One of the main reasons for this, I believe, is because many divers take AN/DP between Intro and Apprentice. This can take some time and money and a year or year and a half might not be enough. I have reissued some intro cave certifications. The new NACD standards will have Intro Cave expire after 24 months for this reason. Apprentice will remain at 12 months for now.

Makes sense.

[vicp]

... The new NACD standards will have Intro Cave expire after 24 months ...

Is this for the just the doubles portion or the whole cert?

[RN]

Doubles. The single cylinder cert will remain unchanged as far as being a non-expiring certification.

[Jax]

Doubles. The single cylinder cert will remain unchanged as far as being a non-expiring certification.

Why do they do that? I don't see the slightest reason why they should be treated different.

[RN]

Personally, I don't see a point in even allowing a single cylinder beyond the cavern zone. It's not enough redundancy.

However, to answer your question, a single cylinder will limit penetration distance simply by the amount of gas in the cylinder. Double cylinders are limited to 1/6 for the same reason but after diving 1/6 for a while divers might start pushing that and diving beyond the 1/6 penetration pressure since they have the gas available. This is the reason for the expiring certification. When the cert expires the card reverts to a single cylinder card. I believe Ginnie will at that point only issue an armband with single cylinder intro on it.

[tstormdiver]

When I went through Cavern, Intro to Cave & Full Cave, the first time, it was with a thought of, "let's see how far we get". Well I got through Cavern & Intro, but spent the next 2 yrs & 5 attempts to get through Full Cave. I would go through, not perform satisfactorily at a skill, go home, practice my butt off in the local quarry, perfect the skill, then return & repeat. I even had some kind folks who helped to mentor me during that period. When I finally passed full cave, I knew exactly what I had accomplished. I am now into my 3rd year of full cave & have been taking the time to learn well, the systems I am familiar with. I find TDI's CCR Cave course to be a bit strange, as there is no allowance for someone that is already Full Cave. I understand the levels for someone not familiar with cave environment, but for someone who is already Full Cave? I certainly understand the need to cover the skills, gas planning & such, that are specific to using a CCR in a cave environment & the unit being used, but to have to go through how to run a reel, anti silting techniques doing jumps,......???? Shouldn't that already be ingrained into a Full Cave diver to begin with? I know it was ingrained deeply in me, to the point of being second nature. Right now, the thing slowing me up from the CCR Cave course is getting in the required hours on the unit. The nasty & cold weather here in KY is slowing things considerably. Once spring arrives,...... Watch out!

[RN]

Have you read the TDI standards or was this just something that was told to you? The prerequisites for the TDI full cave course are as follows.

1. Minimum age 18
2. Certified TDI CCR Air Diluent Decompression Procedures Diver certification or equivalent
3. Provide proof of certification as a:
a. TDI Rebreather Introductory Cave Diver or equivalent
OR
b. TDI Full Cave Diver or equivalent
4. Provide proof of a minimum of 50 logged dives and 50 hours on the rebreather unit used.

The student must demonstrate the ability to conduct all the skills but there's nothing in there that states the student must be taught how to run a reel. The prerequisites account for that. It is a good idea to demonstrate these skills on a rebreather though as that compounds the task loading that's already there to begin with.