What is your reason for not diving a rebreather while cave diving?

[CCRMichael]

I wanted to do a poll to all you cave divers that cave dive open circuit to find out your reasons for not diving a rebreather. You can select multiple options in the poll. If there is a reason not listed here please let us know.

Too expensive (initial cost to purchase CCR)
Too expensive (consumables to dive ie cells, sorb, O2 etc)
Training (Don't want more training or training is expensive)
Do not think they are safe
Too complicated (prefer simplicity of OC)
My buddies or team all dive OC
I don't understand enough about rebreathers
I have never tried one
I dive exclusively sidemount and don't want anything on my back
I only do short or shallow dives
I don't see a benefit

If you do dive a rebreather and you used to only dive OC you can put the reasons that kept you from buying a rebreather and then explain how you overcame them.

[jxh2297]

I have alot of reasons I do not see myself diving a rebreather anytime in the near future. Just for a background I have dove with rebreather cave divers quite a bit but have no rebreather experience myself. 1. I do not dive enough- Living almost 1000 miles from cave country I dive alot but it is broke up into months. Some months I get to stay in cave country and dive everyday and then I will go 6 months without making a cave dive. I see this as dangerous in rebreathers (and even open circuit). Skills can degrade over time and with the complexity of rebreathers can go pretty quick. Ill try to make this short since I could go on with a list a mile long. #2. They are just to complex in an emergency situation. When it comes down to it in an emergency situation or when "sh%$ hits the fan" most people cannot even think straight enough to put a reg in there mouth. Basically to sum things up rebreathers take a mind that is thinking straight to operate safely. To me most tourist cave divers that come for vacation just do not have the mindset to keep a level head during an emergency on a rebreather. Divers that dive there rebreathers every week or every day I do believe develop the mind that it takes to survive an emergency. I just dont think to majority of people that get into them ever get close.

[CCRMichael]

I have alot of reasons I do not see myself diving a rebreather anytime in the near future. Just for a background I have dove with rebreather cave divers quite a bit but have no rebreather experience myself. 1. I do not dive enough- Living almost 1000 miles from cave country I dive alot but it is broke up into months. Some months I get to stay in cave country and dive everyday and then I will go 6 months without making a cave dive. I see this as dangerous in rebreathers (and even open circuit). Skills can degrade over time and with the complexity of rebreathers can go pretty quick. Ill try to make this short since I could go on with a list a mile long. #2. They are just to complex in an emergency situation. When it comes down to it in an emergency situation or when "sh%$ hits the fan" most people cannot even think straight enough to put a reg in there mouth. Basically to sum things up rebreathers take a mind that is thinking straight to operate safely. To me most tourist cave divers that come for vacation just do not have the mindset to keep a level head during an emergency on a rebreather. Divers that dive there rebreathers every week or every day I do believe develop the mind that it takes to survive an emergency. I just dont think to majority of people that get into them ever get close.

Thanks for the response. I should of included on the list of options a choice for those that do not dive enough to stay up on the skills etc.

[Sabado]

Three reasons mainly
1. I have been on far too many dives where something failed on the rebreather AFTER the pre dive check but before the dive. The dives had to be cancelled before they even got started. I know this may not be indicative of everyone's experience.

2. The amount of time in maintenance and care. I just don't have time to give that rig the attention it deserves. OC is a bit more forgiving.

3. When cave diving CCR you bring two bailout bottles which when you add it up is nearly the amount of gear I bring into a cave doing an OC dive with a stage or two.

However if everything goes right gear-wise, CCR is safer from a contingency planning perspective if one were to get lost and exit time were to be delayed.

[keri.lewis]

How about... the dives I am doing do not require the additional capability for a CCR and are therefore easier and better on OC?

I am actually just considering a move towards CCR for a pure logistics purpose. It'll be a Chest mount or a Sidemount CCR in all probability to reduce the number of cylinders needed to be hauled to the water through the cave..

[r4e]

Several reasons:
1) Reliability - in about 25% of my dives, anyone in the team will thumb the dive on the surface or during the first 5 minutes due to a problem in his/her RB.
2) Safety statistics - a ten times difference.
3) I do not expect myself to be systematic enough in maintaining a RB.
4) Higher work of breating (WOB) - I have experienced DIPO and now appreciate the thinness of the lung membrane. Any additional pressure difference, e.g. caused by greater WOB, might increase the possibility of DIPO repeating. Swimming any distance at all during DIPO is no fun.
5) I do not believe I am a better diver than some very experienced RB divers who have met their fate. Even more so after an accident couple of days ago - a person I dived with earlier this month and who was regarded as one of the best cave divers here.

I appreciate all RB divers who really need a RB as a tool in their adventures and make an educated safety assessment about this. I lift my hat to all RB divers diving devices with single digit serial numbers. But, I feel sorry for the 90% wannabees letting coolness factors affect their decisions.

[Sludge]

I have experienced DIPO and now appreciate the thinness of the lung membrane.

I Googled this and still don't know what it is...

[r4e]

I Googled this and still don't know what it is...

DIPO = Diving-Induced-Pulmonary-Oedema. Same as IPE = Immersion-Induced-Pulmonary-Edema.
See for example http://www.cavediver.net/forum/showt...dema-%28IPE%29

[swadiver]

Several reasons:
1) Reliability - in about 25% of my dives, anyone in the team will thumb the dive on the surface or during the first 5 minutes due to a problem in his/her RB.
2) Safety statistics - a ten times difference.
3) I do not expect myself to be systematic enough in maintaining a RB.
4) Higher work of breating (WOB) - I have experienced DIPO and now appreciate the thinness of the lung membrane. Any additional pressure difference, e.g. caused by greater WOB, might increase the possibility of DIPO repeating. Swimming any distance at all during DIPO is no fun.
5) I do not believe I am a better diver than some very experienced RB divers who have met their fate. Even more so after an accident couple of days ago - a person I dived with earlier this month and who was regarded as one of the best cave divers here.

I appreciate all RB divers who really need a RB as a tool in their adventures and make an educated safety assessment about this. I lift my hat to all RB divers diving devices with single digit serial numbers. But, I feel sorry for the 90% wannabees letting coolness factors affect their decisions.

To address your first point, one I hear a lot from non CCR divers: when it comes to reliability, not all rebreathers are created equal. some units, like the Revo, excel in this area.

[Garth]

To address your first point, one I hear a lot from non CCR divers: when it comes to reliability, not all rebreathers are created equal. some units, like the Revo, excel in this area.

I've heard that they are less reliable when dropped or fall from a boat stand... just like all the rest.