Untrained cave diving in the DR

[tomhauburn]

As far as accepting Cave Cards in lot of places the most popular ones are Visa, MC and AE.

[phillip1]

Believe me when I say "We Ruffled LOTS of Feathers"!!!!
But even after plucking half the barn yard, nothing was done, and all that was accomplished was a few pillows filled with feathers.

I commend you on ruffling many feathers with Beeker but how about plucking another half barnyard and doing the same with Gri Gri by dropping all ADM current and future endorsement if they do not stop taking OW divers on full cave dives?

On the Beeker subject, in addition to all the untrained cave diving and what that entails he has no official permits to take artifacts out of the DR.

[Curt Bowen]

Man, I have to tell you, if you where half as persistent on GRI GRI, and the other local dive shops as you are on expecting me to take the bull by the horns and changing sponsored editorials completed years ago, I think you would be filling tanks and teaching cave diving at GRI GRI while dating the owners daughter and driving daddy's car. (beep beep, get outa way ho's, I'm sportin da GRI GRI ride)

I am positive I already informed you 3 or 4 times I do not plan on returning to that area of the DR.

A suggestion would be, drive over to GRI GRI, since you live there, and speak to the horses mouth yourself. Unless of course you think you may get shot in the process. But do not worry, if they hit you in the head, it's hard enough, the bullet will never penetrate.

I commend you on ruffling many feathers with Beeker but how about plucking another half barnyard and doing the same with Gri Gri by dropping all ADM current and future endorsement if they do not stop taking OW divers on full cave dives?

On the Beeker subject, in addition to all the untrained cave diving and what that entails he has no official permits to take artifacts out of the DR.

[Curt Bowen]

As far as accepting Cave Cards in lot of places the most popular ones are Visa, MC and AE.

They do not take American Express at any DR cave, BUT MC and Visa are accepted at most caves world wide.

[FW]

Curt, Phillip, please read rule #6. This thread is getting out of hand. I would hate to have to give either of you a "vacation".

Rule #6. Comments about individuals, agencies, organizations and businesses will be removed if found to be inflammatory or cause the discussion to be uncivil.

[Neptuno]

people here still wondering who issued the permits to research and remove all those artifacts from the sites mentioned....(and from the country)

so, all the divers taking that scientific training at el chicho that time where cave divers? in single tanks and octopus regs? not to mention those very little lights and no reels.

as far as grigri (which is the one that for sure keep doing it) and before the other divecenters as well, that soon or late we will know if they keep doing it, they always knew that is wrong and never cared, and they really don't get that much money from that, they just seduce people to think is cool to go to a cave with those cool guys that laugh a lot as guides that are maybe barely divemasters, or in earlier cases at other divecenters, not even open waters because they were building their careers for free in change of certifications(which are issued at the end of the contract, so, cavediving and guiding with nothing).

the owners know very well that problem, and don't care, and they even tell the divemasters to go there, so is not a problem about families and food on their tables, giving a cavern class will give them more money and do it properly, or a cave class if the customers want to go further.

As far as the website, it mentions Uwe as the co-owner, and that about bringing it to the attention of the owner is BS, they all know very well.
(as a note:I do not know anyone at that place, I just see some videos and people several times on the street told me they are taking people there, same as scubafun and casa daniel used to do in the past, and 'hopefully' sopped it finally).

there are a few instructors as well in punta cana that are doing same thing, but it is a bit harder to track them.

if people wants to kill themself I don't really give a s.... but go jump from a bridge or something, don't seduce customers to believe that is safe to do something dangerous, this stuff is kind of sensitive here now and we are risking caves to be closed if accidents happen, in fact we are risking some caves to be closed now... imagine if a tourist dies in one...

well if people from those stores read this, just do it properly, and people will think about you as a serious store, if you take a diver with no training in a cave, they will find out later that you put their lifes in danger, and you will 100% sure become a blacklisted divecenter because this practice is not serious, then their friends will know about you, and friends of friends.....

I sent a short, polite request for information (from my CBS News e-mail address), and I got a very prompt reply from the University of Indiana today.

-begin quote-

Gary

Thanks for the communication…. Be advised the video is not Indiana University, and we fully acknowledge the serious training necessary for cave diving. The video looks like a group from one of the local sport scuba shops, and is not IU divers. There is no reference to IU in the video.

I am currently in Dominican Republic, and have directed numerous cavern diving research projects in Padre Nuestro and Chicho caverns, but we do not allow any IU researchers to cave dive without proper credentials.

See our IU news release about our research: http://newsinfo.iu.edu/news/page/normal/11644.html

I assume this information is what you are requesting, and hope such on line rumors will get facts correct, before making false accusations about IU academic diving and research activities.

Regards,

Charlie

Charles D. Beeker
Director
Underwater Science
School of HPER, Room 058
Indiana University
Bloomington, IN 47405
http://www.iub.edu/~scuba/



-end quote-

[phillip1]

Man, I have to tell you, if you where half as persistent on GRI GRI, and the other local dive shops as you are on expecting me to take the bull by the horns and changing sponsored editorials completed years ago, I think you would be filling tanks and teaching cave diving at GRI GRI while dating the owners daughter and driving daddy's car. (beep beep, get outa way ho's, I'm sportin da GRI GRI ride)

I am positive I already informed you 3 or 4 times I do not plan on returning to that area of the DR.

A suggestion would be, drive over to GRI GRI, since you live there, and speak to the horses mouth yourself. Unless of course you think you may get shot in the process. But do not worry, if they hit you in the head, it's hard enough, the bullet will never penetrate.

Correct me if I am wrong but what I understand from your above quoted post is that since you do not plan on returning to this area of the DR you just don't care, which is fine that is your opinion just let's be clear.

As for going after dive shops and instructors I have and will continue to do so until we get a safe situation here and this goes for all dive shops with no exceptions.
This persistent annoying attitude is why it appears that all other Bayahibe shops have stopped doing this, if I seem harsh and annoying to some so be it but I tell it like it is and I really don't like BS.

[FW]

Phillip, read post #75.

[SuPrBuGmAn]

Correct me if I am wrong but what I understand from your above quoted post is that since you do not plan on returning to this area of the DR you just don't care, which is fine that is your opinion just let's be clear.

I read it as... you won't see Grigri on any future expedition sponsorships, since ADM isn't going to the DR on expedition any more.

It sounds as though Curt(and co) have made efforts to get shops in the DR to quit letting non-trained divers into caves. I'm going ot go out on a limb and guess he's got other things to do rather than keep at it constantly(as you do, and can, being in the DR).

[phillip1]

"Phillip, read post #75."

oops sorry, I will be more diplomatic from now on I promise.

Really, I did not mean to offend anyone and I apologize if I did, it is just that this whole situation here really gets me mad and unless LDS come to realize how dangerous this type of diving is and stop doing this, someone will get killed and that would be a tragedy for everyone.