Fun in doubles...

[Greenwood_60]

I got my first dive in my PST 104s yesterday. Everything went well except one thing... I spent my entire time fighting being flipped on my back, and a fair amount of the dive on my back.

Here is my setup:
Doubled PST 104s 3300 psi down to about 500
5mm wetsuit and hood
ABS backplate
Dive Rite dual rec wing

My theory is the wing is not wide enough for doubles that big. I have an older dive rite wing that is wider (AFAIK its what became the "classic"). Am I on the right track? Or do you guys all have some superhuman ability to fight flipping over all while frog kicking so gracefully? And I imagine having to use a drysuit for emergency buoyancy would be a mother ******!

[diveconjeff]

Just wish I had someof those superhuman thingys.

I do however dive a set of Worthington 108's (heavy, but basically the same dimensions) with an AL BP. AND I dive them succesfully with my 5 mil wetsuit and rec wing. Until I get below 60 feet. That's when the suit compresses so much I no longer have enough lift.

When I went to the dual clasic for diving my wet suit all was well with my world again.

Of coarse, YMMV

[RAL]

I got my first dive in my PST 104s yesterday. Everything went well except one thing... I spent my entire time fighting being flipped on my back, and a fair amount of the dive on my back.

Here is my setup:
Doubled PST 104s 3300 psi down to about 500
5mm wetsuit and hood
ABS backplate
Dive Rite dual rec wing

My theory is the wing is not wide enough for doubles that big. I have an older dive rite wing that is wider (AFAIK its what became the "classic"). Am I on the right track? Or do you guys all have some superhuman ability to fight flipping over all while frog kicking so gracefully? And I imagine having to use a drysuit for emergency buoyancy would be a mother ******!

Nothing wrong with the classic wing for 104s, that is what was "the setup" when it was "the wing". Turning turtle sometimes happens when you have heavy tanks and "positive" bouyancy below the wing. Dual wing????........are you sure you do not have dual superwings? If so those things were way too big. My buddy used to have a set. we would laugh because you could hear the air moving around in them when he changed positions. Hell they could be used as a life raft in an emergency. Having the air move like that is not to good for stability.


RAL

[Greenwood_60]

Until I get below 60 feet. That's when the suit compresses so much I no longer have enough lift.

No problem yet, but the max depth of the dive was 65 feet.

Nothing wrong with the classic wing for 104s, that is what was "the setup" when it was "the wing". Turning turtle sometimes happens when you have heavy tanks and "positive" bouyancy below the wing. Dual wing????........are you sure you do not have dual superwings?

Nope, Dual Rec Wing. Stairman dove it for years, but I don't remember what tanks he dived. He did also dive wet. It is basically the Dive Rite Rec wing with dual bladders. It can also be used with a single tank, with a bungee system keeping it from taco'ing. I will try out my classic next time.

[FW]

I doubt a superwing would flip you over. I do agree it is too big.

The only thing that was ever wrong with the original style wings was when you were going down to a lower level (like a chimney, etc) the air couldn't transfer from one side to the other, and you could get out of balance. For any normal diving, a "classic" wing works fine.

[floridabob]

I have a buddy that has had this problem more than me and he seems to have solved it with a wing having a smaller pillow behind your head. Restricts the air flow back and forth on the wing as you move. I think this problem resolves itself a bit as you begin to create muscle memory to turn around to look behind you rather than lean with one side up and the other side down.

If you are using a dual rec wing, should be plenty wide enoug for doubles, thats what it was designed for: redundant lift without 90 pounds of it.

One other note, I have spent more than 14 years trying to get my weight to lift just right at full versus 500psi. Too much weight means a sail to swim (kinda like the worthingtons, for me). Too little means positive bouyancy at the end. I would find people that dive Fabers and other tanks and spend some time trading back and forth. I personally will not use PSTs as they are way to heavy for me with a dry or wet suit. Others wont dive Fabers for various reasons. Part of the fun of the sport. A compressed 5mm wetsuit is very little bouyancy, so keep that in mind as you decide tanks and dry vs wet.

[stairman]

I dove Faber 95's with it for about 4 years. Never had a problem with turtleing. Be sure the backup is completely empty. I did have an alumuinum backplate but I doubt if that makes a difference. Doubles are a little different than a single and the first few times may be a little awkward, especially with fairly large 8 inch diameter steel tanks. I dove 1 stage bottle with that wing and still stayed balanced fine and run my can light on my right hip. PM me if you go to Peacock some Sunday and Ill jump in with em and see how it feels.

[Greenwood_60]

Be sure the backup is completely empty.

Yep, empty. I inflate the primary 100% then push the button on the backup to make sure its empty before diving. I have kept them both partially inflated when stored.

[Greenwood_60]

It wasn't really a problem of going one way or the other. Left, right, head up, feet up, I was fighting it all, the entire dive. Imagine duct taping a lead weight to a balloon and trying the get it to stay "weight up" in the water.! That's what i felt like. At one point I was sinking tanks first, and grabbing for an inflator that wasn't staying where I put it... all in all, I still had a blast.

Randy - I will take you up on that... even if I get it figured out before then, you can show me the ropes up there.

[FW]

I am glad to see you working out the bugs in your doubles before taking cave training in them. It will save you a lot of time and money