<snark, snark>!!!Originally Posted by netmage
Welcome to the Cave Diver's Forum.
<snark, snark>!!!
LOL.....
Safe diving,
Rich
P.S. As a side note, does anyone else apart from me wish the crossover line was back on the wall? There's a ring of devastation around that stupid cone at the jump to the Olsen line. It never looked like that previously......
Last edited by Rich; 11-15-2010 at 02:40 PM. Reason: a mild vent.... ;)
Good question. Off the top of my head and thinking more or less out loud there are pros and cons.
1) Wherever you put it you want to make it easy to keep the line out of the middle of the passage - that will mean fairly close to the floor on that particular jump.
2) Coming out of the crossover tunnel, you have a large buoyancy change from the descent and coming up the Olsen tunnel you have a more subtle change in buoyancy. IMHO the problem (obviously) is with divers who are not properly stabilized in terms of buoyancy and then have trouble holding a hover while putting in the jump.
3) Putting it back on the wall gives them something to contact (other than the floor) to help stabilize, but it does not resolve the over-arching "lack of adequate skill" problem.
4) In that regard, we had a student in our full cave class who had similar issues and the instructor pointed out that, worse comes to worse, if you can't get the hover accomplished just put a finger on the concrete cone to stabilize rather than screwing up the cave floor by contacting it and/or silting the passage with fin kicks trying to stabilize near the floor. The "lesser of two evils" logic made some sense, and in that regard it becomes a question of do you want people stabilizing on the cone or on the wall?
I do agree that area is pretty unsightly.
Neither one.
Jim Wyatt
Cavediveflorida
+1
Safe diving,
Rich
Personally, I'd rather they learn how to cave dive.
I'll refrain from a "no **** Captain(s) Obvious" statement and just say we are all in agreement.
The point is moving the line will not solve the problem. At best, all it will do is impact where the damage from poorly skilled divers occurs and what type of damage occurs.
We'd all prefer everyone making that jump have solid buoyancy skills or at least the self discipline to recognize they do not have the skills to place the jump without damaging the cave and then either not make it or have someone else put it in. However no one here apparently has any solution to the shitty skills and/or lack of self discipline issues.
Then there is the fact it is a section of cave that sees a large amount of full cave level training, so divers with questionable skills are almost by definition placing jumps there.
Given that, the only available action left (other than to have instructors stop doing training there and/or stop turning out poorly skilled or poorly disciplined divers - and I don't see the instructors in the thread suggesting that) is to determine where you want the inevitable damage to occur and what type of damage you would prefer to accept.
Rich, that's all pretty obvious and your +1 to Jim's "neither" response begs the question why you brought it up in the first place if controlling where the damage occurs was not the issue you were considering and wanting to discuss. If you have no point in bringing it up then it's just pot stirring and isn't productive.
:d :d :d :d :d :d
+2
Nice....... Well the problem is that the cone is on an angled slope where it encourages inexperienced divers to get their fins and or hands into the silt. I know that you haven't been cave diving long enough to realize where the lines used to be in that area of the tunnel, but when I return home, I'll try and send you some pics so maybe you'll understand just a little bit better.....
Safe diving,
Rich
+1
...
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