Rules of Engagement?? what have you done?

[phillip1]

In my experience (the DR) the problem lies 100% with PADI MSDT instructors taking OW clienst way past the cavern zone, these morornic instructors know the overhead diving hazards and limitations yet feel the safety rules do not apply to them.
Also in my experience PADI could not care less, I think they are well aware of the many cave "excursions" going on worldwide by PADI instructors yet they do absolutely zero.
Again in my experience dealing with OW instructors it's like talking to a brick wall they really think that they know better and I am anoying for even bringing this up.
If PADI cared they would send out a email to all the LDS and instructors worldwide reminding them of the limtations and safety guidlines of cavern/cave diving.

About a year and a half ago PADI told me they were going to do this and that they were aware of this problem but so far nothing.
As I said previously in the DR even the cave diving safety officer is doing zilch about instaling signs and safety education so we are not waiting around for anyone's help and doing it all ourselves.

I think that it is every cave diver's responsibility to inform OW divers and the general public on the dangers of untrained cave diving at every occasion you get.
If even only one person listens toyou, you may have saved his/her life.

[Skorpiov]

You may have had incidents the specific people from PADI but there are instructors in all training organizations including iantd and nacd that break training standards. The problem isn't just one organization.

[ltb7733]

where can i find that video called decepitively easy way to die? is it on the forum somewhere?

[SuPrBuGmAn]

YouTube it, one of the recent threads also had a link to it.

[Major Restriction]

where can i find that video called decepitively easy way to die? is it on the forum somewhere?

http://goo.gl/ysdj

[J_glenn06]

As an OW instructor and a cave diver, i dont show my students the easy way to die video i do very much stress that if they are even remotley intrested in caves to go get the training and i give them the nacd website. I dont do any checkout dives at ginnie or peacock for that reason only vortex. I will take them down to the edge of the cavern so they can see the sign and me give the the overhead signal and shake my head. i have also told them that if i hear or find out that any one of my students have gone in the caves or any overhead of that matter they will be getting a nice phone call and haveing a little "come to jesus meeting"

[Tegg]

where can i find that video called decepitively easy way to die? is it on the forum somewhere?

It can also be bought from the CDS store.

[vshearer]

YouTube it, one of the recent threads also had a link to it.

The one that really got to me, mentioned earlier, is Rescue 911 (episode 202), also on youtube.

Part 1

Part 2


Why anyone would go in untrained after watching that eludes me.

[phillip1]

You may have had incidents the specific people from PADI but there are instructors in all training organizations including iantd and nacd that break training standards. The problem isn't just one organization.

could be, it is a really bad situation when the actual instructors are the ones at fault for taking OW divers way past the cavern zone.
And an even worse one when training agencies don't do anything at all to sanction any such instructors or LDS.

As long as the PADI's and co of the world don't get in legal trouble I think they could not care less.

[mfascuba]

Shortly after I started cave diving (before full cave was complete) I bought a copy of "a deceptively easy way to die" and handed it to my LDS in Fort Myers, told them to show it at the end of every OW class. I don't know if they do or don't (I don't go in there too often these days), but I figured it might help to put the information out there.

As far as interacting with OW divers, if I see them coming in and I'm going out, they get blinded with a 21W HID to the face - hopefully they won't be able to see anything and they will leave. I was told in my cave classes to NOT touch anyone, lest I risk the assault charges. But I've given a good eyefull of HID to a few folks over the years.

Mark