How Long?

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We did a bit of personality research awhile back on scuba divers and cave divers. DA Aquamaster summarized our findings nicely. Cave divers tend to be somewhat lower in thrill-seeking than scuba divers (both well above the general population). The interesting difference was that cave divers tend to have higher self-esteem and a very high degree of impulse-control. They also tend to be inventive, creative. It's unusual to find abnormally high impulse control AND abnormally high thrill-seeking tendencies in the same person. This, I think, is the controlled-risk, or risk management idea expressed by DA Aquamaster (and FW).

I suspect there are scuba divers who get into cave diving for the thrill-seeking aspect, but who are also a bit implusive and these probably don't last long - they may even be the primary group of students and newbies who race through the cave, ignore cave-etiquitte, violate conservation, etc. They may constitute the five-year or less group.

On a personal note, but one I think many of us can relate to, I too am like DA Aquamaster - His post was like something I could have posted! I'm the one at work developing new ways of doing things, pushing the envelope, getting called to the principle's office (things don't always go as planned out there on the edge!), and although most everyone around me thinks I am a risk-taking thrill-seeking adrenaline junkie, I am way more into reducing risk, going cautiously into new situations, planning things down to the smallest detail, and having back-ups for back-ups!

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[Spd 135]

I never think of cavediving as risky. I have done some risky things, like racing motocross, and hang gliding, but the most dangerous thing about cavediving is driving to the cave.

I very much agree with you Forrest. If I want adrenaline, work will cover it. I like the idea of getting away from everyone into clear water and beautiful rock. I started in 99 with Pat Watson and then Cave in 02 with Lamar Hires. I have never looked back. Like Rob N and Mat, "off the beaten path" has some great stuff and that never gets old.

[sskasser]

I had a couple of divers that trained me state that quite a few divers make 100 dives as a goal then slack off and sort of drift away. Usually if 200 dives were reached people stay. Which would be more realistic to me as people live out of town, have accidents, family obligations, take time off etc.
I suppose I will cave dive until I break a hip climbing into a sink hole etc. Then I can really do some fun stuff like work on the museum more. There is so much more to learn.

Woo hoo! I guess y'all are stuck with me, then! Buwahahahaha!

[Sludge]

Forrest... every time I see him some place everyone else is standing around talking and he's diving.

Unless he's diving with me. Then he's complaining, "Will you stop standing around talking and let's go diving!"

[ssmdive]

Skip,

Looking at the frequency of 3-5 vs 6-10, and assuming a constant entry rate over the period, the hypothesis looks to probably be correct. However, given the high number OVER 10, it seems that if you get to 10, you pretty much never leave. It'd be nice to use a hazard rate model with annual numbers - 1,2,3, etc - rather than censored data, but I bet a fancy model would give the same result.

Therre's a selection bias problem of course - this could mean that they leave boards after 5 years rather than that they stop diving.

OK, hijack over, y'all can go back to talking about how old Forrest is...

We did this same type of research in skydiving. What we found was the average "life span" of an active skydiver was 3 years or 300 jumps. If a skydiver made it over 10 years we figured they would stick around.

The reasons people quit:

1. They had what they perceived to be a close call and that removed the "I'm bullet proof" mentality. The close call could have been as simple as a main parachute malfunction, or something really dangerous like a low canopy collision. In either case the perceived danger shook them into realizing that they could get hurt/killed.

2. They saw a person die, or a friend died. In both cases the same thought process happens. They see or feel the fatality first hand and they go through the process explained in #1.

3. Family issues. We have a joke that when a guy gets married to a "whuffo" (A person who when you say you skydive asks "What for?") we start giving him offers for his gear.

4. Once you get to a certain level... It can be difficult to go past that level. So other activities/hobbies start to give you that rush and are more exciting and you tend to go to them. I have seen this in many sports/hobbies. In martial arts it was the blue belt... They have some skill and land some good hits/takedowns , but not nearly as good as red belts. Most people quit at blue belt. In skydiving it is around 300-500 jumps where you have some skills, but not enough to get invited on the good loads. For caving, I am assuming that it hits those that only do the "tourist caves"... They get sick of the traffic jams and rude behavior just to see the same things over and over.

I know I am a #4.
1. I have had many close calls and they don't really bother me.

2. I have seen friends die and been a first responder many times. (Only one bothered me... His son wanted to meet and talk about the accident and I did it to help bring closure to the family).

3. I married a skydiver.... Twice. And the second one I gave her SCUBA lessons for her Bday.

[SDHussey]

DA Aquamaster's assessment (both self and group) applies to myself likewise. If I sought thrills, I would have probably become a much better skateboarder. Because of my age (31), many of my friends skated. Lacking coordination, understanding the inherent risks and physics of skating, and having a high payoff vis-a-vis pain avoidance comprehension, I mostly quit skating after the first broken bone.

That said, I did not stop seeking challenges or what others called "adventures." I have backpacked Southeast Asia, China, and Central America while living in foreign countries as a English teacher. I have gone skydiving and bungee jumping on several occassions. I have own motorcycles both overseas and here (I do not see this as inherently risky). Yet, until I started diving and then cave diving, I did not find a sport/recreation that fit my personality. Cave Diving and the cave community fits my personality well. Risk management, serenity, communing with the natural environment, and mostly reserved community externally. What has prevented me from having more time or certifications is my age and graduate school. Cave Diving is not for the faint of wallet and my life-style does not bode well with making money. That said, I am about to marry my dive-buddy so I plan on continuing to dive for some time. Besides - Slow and steady - the hare got bored, the turtle won.

[Sludge]

understanding the inherent risks and physics of skating

Go to my Facebook page (Russell Edge) and you'll see a video of me hitting almost 30mph on Rollerblades with a Doberman pinscher on a leash. Apparently I haven't learned "the inherent risks and physics."

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Go to my Facebook page (Russell Edge) and you'll see a video of me hitting almost 30mph on Rollerblades with a Doberman pinscher on a leash. Apparently I haven't learned "the inherent risks and physics."

our new puppy, a golden retriever, is getting big and strong and is pulling me about 35mph on the soles of my tennis shoes! I bought a skateboard to save the tennis shoes, but maybe rollerblades would be more fun! I don't want to know the physics; at my age they can't be good.

hmmm.

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[sskasser]

our new puppy, a golden retriever, is getting big and strong and is pulling me about 35mph on the soles of my tennis shoes! I bought a skateboard to save the tennis shoes, but maybe rollerblades would be more fun! I don't want to know the physics; at my age they can't be good.

hmmm.

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OMG! The memories! A golden retriever and bicycle is a bad combination! Mine was easily distracted and took me out one day when something caught his attention on the other side of me. I miss that big dumb sweetie!

[SDHussey]

Sadly, the yorkie I inherited with the future-wife poorly compares to my childhood boxer in rollerblade mushing. Thou the little bugger tries ...

If I want cheap thrills on my own wheels I'll draft trucks on my road cannondale.