What would you do? (line safety situation)

[skip]

If you don't plan to do any jumps, one spool is supposed to be enough, but I agree that it sometimes isn't.

FWIW, I never carry less than 3, and add one for each planned jump.

In intro class, doing lost line drill, and no lights, I dropped my spool while trying to tie off! No worries, just pulled out a back up and continued. Taught me to make sure I always have a backup or two!

-skip

[refinished]

I fouled my safety during the same drill in my cave course. Not ten minutes before the dive, my instructor was telling me the benefits of having two safeties. I jammed the reel under a ledge and went for the second safety and found the line. I had jump reels, but that was just by chance. Lesson learned and permanently imprinted... +1 for lessons learned in training.

[atedeschi]

I have to say for all the planning I do with gas and other stuff, I never thought about bringing a backup saftey spool. Part of my reasoning was well I keep it in my pocket clipped off, so it can not disappear unnoticed and usually carry one more spool then need for jumps. Today I just ordered another 150' FS to keep in my pocket with my other one, if nothing more I have knotted line incase i find the passage everyone else missed with no line in it

What was the condition of the line pre breakage and did you look at the line you brought out with you to see if it looked in bad shape?

[FW]

...Today I just ordered another 150' FS to keep in my pocket with my other one, if nothing more I have knotted line incase i find the passage everyone else missed with no line in it ...

If you really find a new passage, you will wish you had more than 150'

...What was the condition of the line pre breakage and did you look at the line you brought out with you to see if it looked in bad shape?

The old line may not tell you much about the break. I have a lot of line that I pulled out of a flood prone cave. It was broken in a dozen places, but what survived the flood was in fairly good shape. I still use it like twine for non critical things (like holding the bumper on my truck).

[rchrds]

Current can be a dangerous thing to follow too. I got off the (very black) line between Catfish Hotel, and the main spring at Manatee. I tried to follow the current out, and ended up in a dead end room.

Ooh- I've done that exact same thing, in the same place. Funny. But it wasn't at the time.

The number of spools/amount of line is sort or irrelevant to the original poster's question, and so, in a way, is the solo issue. Once you run out of spools/line (I carry an exploration reel with me all the time, but I'm usually exploring...) What to do then? Can you be sure that after laying all of that line that you are indeed going the correct direction? I think that regardless of flow- if I dumped that much line, I would be very suspicious that i had gone the wrong direction- It's pretty rare that even in a high flow cave more than a couple of hundred feet of line could get stripped on the same dive you had just made- there are usually more tieoffs than that- it will pile up somewhere eventually. I might agree that a 60 foot spool might not be enough- in large passage I may tie off only every 50 feet or so- if you cut the line before a tieoff, and it worked lose of the one before it...

As for the solo issue- what more is the buddy doing than providing a light at the end of the line? This might put you in a worse position- say you are already in your last third after searching for a while- and you finally find the end of the line beyond the light range of your buddy? You have to go back for him- but you could have just left your light there to recover later...

Interesting post, thanks original poster. And i do like Andrew's suggestions.

Haha- and Forrest, I must admit to this, because you reminded me of it- What better use for branch or side lines- I have been guilty of completely stripping all of the side lines in a sump to extend the exploration, as we had long since run out of line. I still feel slightly guilty about it- but the original explorer is now dead, and there have been a sum total of 4 people ever in the underwater part of the cave- If someone wants to make the 3 day donkey ride down to the spring, I'll buy a couple of spools of line for them...

Jason

[FW]

...Haha- and Forrest, I must admit to this, because you reminded me of it- What better use for branch or side lines- I have been guilty of completely stripping all of the side lines in a sump to extend the exploration, as we had long since run out of line. I still feel slightly guilty about it- but the original explorer is now dead, and there have been a sum total of 4 people ever in the underwater part of the cave- If someone wants to make the 3 day donkey ride down to the spring, I'll buy a couple of spools of line for them...

Jason

Ask Jose Morales about doing that in J2

[MORGAN]

I still use it like twine for non critical things (like holding the bumper on my truck).

I've got some 25 year old Bluewater II that I use the same way. Old caving rope never dies.

Mike

[Kelly Jessop]

i'm really not sure exactly what caused the break, however I noticed on entry that in many areas, especially the restrictions, the line was very slack. I originally noticed this when watching the youtube video of Agnes diving the system and had thought while making the video she broke the line, but then after getting into dive myself realized she didn't in fact do anything, that is just how the line is... very slack and likely to catch on things. I noticed several times the line catching on my fin heel area and also my pee-valve bolt (I hadn't dove with the bolt in for years but recently was having leaks so I put the bolt back in to minimize them). The several line hangups I had during the dive were easily noticed and corrected, but obvoiusly this one wasn't. I'm sure on entry any extra pulling or drag that could have been me hung up on the slack line could have been confused with the flow... I was working hard the whole dive due to the high flow and not wanting to touch delicate areas.

Got to be real careful in river cave because frequently the line is old twisted #18,and have seen this stuff break without too much difficulty. I have developed a lot of different protocols for diving caves with old line like this ie never drop a stage on the line,but run a reel from the original line,and place the stages on your line etc.

[Rich]

I noticed on entry that in many areas, especially the restrictions, the line was very slack.

AFAIK the line is laid this way deliberately in sidemount caves, so you can "work the line" as needed to get through restrictions. In fact, I mentioned this to my buddy Bob L, whom I'd taken into Rock Bluff the day before Matt's dive, and afterwards he mentioned that he was glad I told him or he'd have tried to tighten it up....

Safe diving,

Rich

[stairman]

Ive never heard of this either Rich, thanks for the info.