Would you practice "cave diving" in a quarry?

[OutlawCaver]

Just make the dives at night, run lines and assume everything over you is cave ceiling.

IMHO, since the run of Vortex was once navigable before the construction of the dam, all of the crap in the basin at Vortex is on public property anyway and should be removed. I would like to see a certified survey showing their property lines where the water is included and a permit for the dam and dredging. I am such an ass.

[Me]

There's another quarry in the area that has a stone crusher tower that is underwater. It has a tunnel that requires a waiver be signed....now granted they can't police it, but if you have a mishap and no waiver signed......

[jj1987]

Just make the dives at night, run lines and assume everything over you is cave ceiling.

IMHO, since the run of Vortex was once navigable before the construction of the dam, all of the crap in the basin at Vortex is on public property anyway and should be removed. I would like to see a certified survey showing their property lines where the water is included and a permit for the dam and dredging. I am such an ass.

And I think we should pull the grate out of Ginnie (volunteers?), but I'm afraid neither of us will get our way

In all seriousness, is there a legit reason for a grate to be installed in Ginnie? I mean I can't imagine it being worse than Royal, and Royal isnt grated, nor should it be IMO. Legal repercussions for starting a "Ginnie restoration project"?

[Meister481]

The guy who is doing the installation is one of my instructors. He's trying to do several things. Firstly he wants to replicate a cavern environment for teaching line drills and cave skills. There will be offshoots and T's in the "cave". It will also have Fiberglass features within the culverts.

He's an NACD instructor and is trying to allow for more training in the simulated cave to get the students up to speed and kicking properly before they get in an actual cave. Just another tool in the toolbox, not intended as a shortcut for training. It's meant to enhance the preparation process.

They're trying to refine a safety process before it's installed as well, they don't want it to become a danger. I know many who dislike the owner, but I for one commend Mike for his genuine concern for the divers who frequent his site.

[FW]

And I think we should pull the grate out of Ginnie (volunteers?), but I'm afraid neither of us will get our way

In all seriousness, is there a legit reason for a grate to be installed in Ginnie? I mean I can't imagine it being worse than Royal, and Royal isnt grated, nor should it be IMO. Legal repercussions for starting a "Ginnie restoration project"?

Ginnie used to have the highest fatality record of any cave. IIRC, there were around 30 deaths there before that grate was put in. The fatalities prompted Gilcrest county into passing a law against cave diving. It was only repealed a few years ago.

The ONLY reason we can dive anywhere in Gilcrest county is because we, the cave divers, convinced the landowner that Ginnie would be safe with the grate. It was a small price to pay to keep access to Devil's Eye.

[kidsdream]

The idea is great although the plans on how to make side tunnels is still very sketchy. Also I don't think self policing will work unless the area is seperated from the rest of the quarry.

I do like Mike and this may certainly be his most ambitious project yet.

The guy who is doing the installation is one of my instructors. He's trying to do several things. Firstly he wants to replicate a cavern environment for teaching line drills and cave skills. There will be offshoots and T's in the "cave". It will also have Fiberglass features within the culverts.

He's an NACD instructor and is trying to allow for more training in the simulated cave to get the students up to speed and kicking properly before they get in an actual cave. Just another tool in the toolbox, not intended as a shortcut for training. It's meant to enhance the preparation process.

They're trying to refine a safety process before it's installed as well, they don't want it to become a danger. I know many who dislike the owner, but I for one commend Mike for his genuine concern for the divers who frequent his site.

[RN]

And I think we should pull the grate out of Ginnie (volunteers?), but I'm afraid neither of us will get our way

In all seriousness, is there a legit reason for a grate to be installed in Ginnie? I mean I can't imagine it being worse than Royal, and Royal isnt grated, nor should it be IMO. Legal repercussions for starting a "Ginnie restoration project"?

OW divers won't stay out of the cave zone at Vortex. Pull the Ginnie grate and people will start dying.

[aainslie]

How are they going to keep unqualified divers out?

Sounds like a death (or two) waiting to happen. That site is too popular with low-cert divers.

[Meister481]

How are they going to keep unqualified divers out?

Sounds like a death (or two) waiting to happen. That site is too popular with low-cert divers.

A grate..... lol

They are considering installing a gate on the end. Last person locks the gate behind them after a search of the interior. It's going to be a long process to install the tiles and get them properly aligned.

[jj1987]

How are they going to keep unqualified divers out?

Sounds like a death (or two) waiting to happen. That site is too popular with low-cert divers.

Ask Eric if he has a brother, he does a fine job over at the Devils area of the park.

A rather obvious solution Andrew, but I'll let you slide since you're officially over the hill now.


I kind of wish it were like Vortex. Then maybe certain hours leave the grate open and prohibit OW divers. Of course this would require the assistance of Ginnie, who I'm sure are completely happy with the cave grated and getting $30 a pop for OW divers.