Peacock Cave Conservation poll

[jj1987]

This may be true perhaps,if so then there are some tunnels that need to have the line completely removed. I recall when the lips leading into the peanut tunnel couldn't be identified as a tunnel,and people would end up in the mistake. Now this feature is wallowed out,with limestone chips everywhere.

Look at the areas of Ginnie in the first 2000ft of the cave where line has been removed that only takes a single stage to get to, and compare that to the damage the first few 100ft past the Heinkle which requires 3 stages or a scooter. 1500ft further much harder to get to, and waaaaay more damage. Heck, even compare the damage to the far right of the lips (going in) vs where the line is, from what I've seen...wherever the line is, damage will follow.

[DA Aquamaster]

Look at the areas of Ginnie in the first 2000ft of the cave where line has been removed that only takes a single stage to get to, and compare that to the damage the first few 100ft past the Heinkle which requires 3 stages or a scooter. 1500ft further much harder to get to, and waaaaay more damage. Heck, even compare the damage to the far right of the lips (going in) vs where the line is, from what I've seen...wherever the line is, damage will follow.

Your observation also makes a strong case that it is not new cave divers doing the damage but rather experienced cave divers who know better but apparently do not care.

I think we are pretty quick (too quick) to excuse damage in the first 1000-1500 feet or so in some systems as they are considered to be "sacrificial" training areas. But obviously a significant percentage of divers seem willing to extend that status to the entire system, not just areas where new divers train.

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Looking at the poll results today, even if only 10% of divers do a pull and glide through the window (thanks for your honesty in admitting it, now please stop doing it) given the volume of traffic it adds up to a lot of cumulative damage as limestone is very soft and the deposits on it are even more fragile.

[DA Aquamaster]

This may be true perhaps,if so then there are some tunnels that need to have the line completely removed. I recall when the lips leading into the peanut tunnel couldn't be identified as a tunnel,and people would end up in the mistake. Now this feature is wallowed out,with limestone chips everywhere.

I have heard the lips at Ginnie used to actually be a restriction.

The problem is not the line but rather a failure to promote and enculturate conservation ethics in a significant percentage of cave divers.

In low flow systems like Peacock, my goal is always to have zero contact with the cave and I don't take it lightly on the rare occassions where I end up being less than perfect and make any kind of contact. In systems where you need to pull, I try to do it with a minimum of damage and when posible use existing holds - that are usually obvious - to prevent the spread of damage.

Places like Cow Springs where the walls are still quite dark, I take care not to venture off the line into pristine areas as those little white chips that some moron made when they just had to go toodling some where off the line are very noticeable and detract from what is otherwise a very beautiful passage.

Some divers however have different goals. In some cases it may be a desire to use more damaging techniques to push the penetration to set a new personal record. I have very little tolerance for that given that the rest of us have to look at the damage that results.