Devil's Eye sand slide

shawn posted about this over on SB at the start of the month; the back wall of the 30' room at the eye had a sand slide, which moved a good amount material into the chute down to the 50' room. makes for a real pain in the rear entering through there with stages and whatnot.

Jayme and I spent about half an hour tonight manually filling and hauling bucketfuls of sand to the exit side of the 30' room at the end of our dive. Uncovered most of the gold line that was buried, and opened up the tight bit of the chute a few inches. Sand spike is still a solid three or four inches under. We wont go anywhere near ginnie on friday through sunday, but will likely dedicate a dive next week hauling more junk out. it's close quarters braille diving, but if anyone wants to join in the fun, hit me up.

PS: I unofficially dub this operation sandstorm.

FWIW, unless you have written permission of the owner, by Florida Statue 810.13 this is considered cave vandalism.


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Originally Posted by Kelly Jessop

FWIW, unless you have written permission of the owner

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man, everything is illegal in the state of FL!

we had verbal from front desk management at check in. 810.13 is an interesting read. 810.13.d lists title owner of land where it is located or a pile of government entities.

who would be best for that kinda written permission; GSO, county, or state?

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Originally Posted by AlexL

man, everything is illegal in the state of FL!

we had verbal from front desk management at check in. 810.13 is an interesting read. 810.13.d lists title owner of land where it is located or a pile of government entities.

who would be best for that kinda written permission; GSO, county, or state?

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I couldn?t answer who to ask, but Ginnie management seems like the best choice , because they have had a propensity to ban people from their property that don?t follow their rules. They have a concern for the cave because they did issue a past edict about exploration, which was ignored. The thing we all have to remember is we don?t own any caves, and get to dive them at the privilege of the owner. So I always say it is critical that we follow good land owner relations. Important to know there are bottom dwelling species that inhabit that area. Tom Morris took me on a dive where he showed locations in the very front half of the cave that is very alive. Good luck.


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No good deed goes unpunished.

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Originally Posted by Kelly Jessop

I couldn?t answer who to ask, but Ginnie management seems like the best choice , because they have had a propensity to ban people from their property that don?t follow their rules.

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noted. it's an interesting intersection of specific law and riparian law, and i am not a lawyer.

very familiar with not pissing off the owners, especially GSO!

when we chatted with front desk, his only concern was disturbing clay; as long as it was sand / shells in that newly created restriction it was OK. i didn't get his name, but we've gotten logistical exemptions for class him before. ill give em a call today and get something in writing for next week; or not, will need to sleep on it.

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Originally Posted by AlexL

noted. it's an interesting intersection of specific law and riparian law, and i am not a lawyer.

very familiar with not pissing off the owners, especially GSO!

when we chatted with front desk, his only concern was disturbing clay; as long as it was sand / shells in that newly created restriction it was OK. i didn't get his name, but we've gotten logistical exemptions for class him before. ill give em a call today and get something in writing for next week; or not, will need to sleep on it.

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There has always been a communication disconnect between front desk, management and security at Ginnie.


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Originally Posted by kensuf

No good deed goes unpunished.

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nah, i get it, from both sides of the table. any other cave, in any other place, would be a 'well, that sucks, guess it'll take me an extra 30 seconds to work through this'. that spot though... it already has enough traffic jams.

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Originally Posted by AlexL

nah, i get it, from both sides of the table. any other cave, in any other place, would be a 'well, that sucks, guess it'll take me an extra 30 seconds to work through this'. that spot though... it already has enough traffic jams.

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Between you, me, and everyone else reading this public thread, I had been thinking of going in there with a scooter and seeing if I can move some of the sand around. I'm appreciative of your effort.

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Originally Posted by Kelly Jessop

There has always been a communication disconnect between front desk, management and security at Ginnie.

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100%, know how that dance goes all too well. im 95% sure we were speaking with 'management', or at least shift management, at the time.

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Originally Posted by kensuf

I had been thinking of going in there with a scooter and seeing if I can move some of the sand around.

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do you hate your scooter? im still picking sand out places i never knew it could get to even after a shower!

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Originally Posted by kensuf

Between you, me, and everyone else reading this public thread, I had been thinking of going in there with a scooter and seeing if I can move some of the sand around. I'm appreciative of your effort.

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Worth noting to this idea in other cave systems too, many species are bottom dwelling and feeding . Disturbing the bottom takes species that are considered imperiled by FNAI away from a food source.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kelly Jessop

Worth noting to this idea in other cave systems too, many species are bottom dwelling and feeding . Disturbing the bottom takes species that are considered imperiled by FNAI away from a food source.


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There's a pen off Hill 400 with plenty of critters that are being raised for the paleo diet crowd. It's a booming business.

True story, I saw three pigmented crayfish both in the basin of the eye and in the run from little devil's Wednesday evening. They were the most I had seen at any given time in several years.

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Originally Posted by kensuf

There's a pen off Hill 400 with plenty of critters that are being raised for the paleo diet crowd. It's a booming business.

True story, I saw three pigmented crayfish both in the basin of the eye and in the run from little devil's Wednesday evening. They were the most I had seen at any given time in several years.

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That?s awesome!!! Perhaps goes along with the SantaFe Crayfish cookbook.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by kensuf

Between you, me, and everyone else reading this public thread, I had been thinking of going in there with a scooter and seeing if I can move some of the sand around. I'm appreciative of your effort.

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There is a new Seacraft for sale in the gear forum. Should do the job.

Ginnie only owns the land access to the cave.

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Originally Posted by jason

Ginnie only owns the land access to the cave.

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I've said it a hundred times, if you are on Ginnie Springs' property and want to go cave diving, the first thing you have to do is leave their property.