Luraville II Spring - Any Info?

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07-18-2006 09:35 AM
JDostal

Luraville II Spring - Any Info?

I'm one of those curious guys that likes to know all kinds of things about the places I dive. Last time I was down in Florida, I dove the Luraville II spring. I've been looking for information about this thing and just can't find anything at all about it anywhere. Are there any maps of the system at all, curious what the "history" of this little spring is. I saw someones email address on a slate in there about some research or other....

It's a beautiful little cave. The walk in wearing tanks SUCKS, and the entrance is definitely one of the more creative things I've had to do, but it was a sweet dive.

Just curious if there is any more info on it out there. I always like looking at a map and seeing where the heck I've been.
07-18-2006 01:24 PM
amphipod06

Did you ask Cathy about it?
She would be a good source.
Dive safe,

Celia
07-18-2006 02:03 PM
JDostal

Haven't asked yet - like I said, I've got hardly any info on this cave :)
07-19-2006 10:18 AM
JE

Luraville Cave system

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

Did you ask Cathy about it?
She would be a good source.
Dive safe,

Celia

Cathy owns it-! You will have to ask her to obtain permission to dive it-! & BTW take a big 'Spyder Stik' with you when you trek in-!

j. 8)
07-19-2006 05:08 PM
Line Squirrel

Re: Luraville II Spring - Any Info?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omicron

Last time I was down in Florida, I dove the Luraville II spring.

Really? Exactly where did you walk in from and where exactly is Luraville "2"? I'd like to know since I dive the Luraville system regularly...with permission.
07-20-2006 07:58 PM
BradfordNC

Re: Luraville II Spring - Any Info?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omicron

Last time I was down in Florida, I dove the Luraville II spring.

Really? Exactly where did you walk in from and where exactly is Luraville "2"? I'd like to know since I dive the Luraville system regularly...with permission.

Mike, i'm thinking they might have parked in that new "parking lot" on the cleared land before reaching Telford and hiked down one of those trails on the property next to Cathy's.
07-21-2006 06:22 AM
Line Squirrel

Re: Luraville II Spring - Any Info?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradfordNC

Mike, i'm thinking they might have parked in that new "parking lot" on the cleared land before reaching Telford and hiked down one of those trails on the property next to Cathy's.

That would be one helluva walk...I need to GPS that someday and see how far that is.
Regardless, it's still a sneak dive.
07-21-2006 08:59 AM
amphipod06

I guess he was not a guest and sneaked it, did he know it was private property?

Dive safe,

Celia
07-21-2006 01:34 PM
Line Squirrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

I guess he was not a guest and sneaked it, did he know it was private property?

Dive safe,

Celia

Hey Celia,
Well, he said the walk sucked, if he had permission, he could have drove there...LIKE I DO :-D
07-21-2006 04:38 PM
amphipod06

Hehhehehehe, I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt...

Hope all is well, when do we go see the rat?

Dive safe,

Celia
07-21-2006 07:33 PM
Line Squirrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

Hehhehehehe, I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt...

Hope all is well, when do we go see the rat?

Dive safe,

Celia

How about this Sunday? :-D Gotta let me know though, so I can jack up my little 85's...need to put'em on ice if you know what I mean.

Who will sit with the vans? I can lend them my ummmm, Glock...I only have 10 round magazines though, the upside is I have hollow points.
07-23-2006 02:43 PM
BradfordNC

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

Who will sit with the vans? I can lend them my ummmm, Glock...I only have 10 round magazines though, the upside is I have hollow points.

Mike,

never knew you were so right wing.

will have to bring my collection next time.
07-24-2006 06:37 AM
rchrds

Luraville Spring Cave System

Hey gang- please dont access the cave from the Telford road- we have good relations with the landowner now (Cathy) and all she asks is that you ask permission, have a modicum of skill and go with someone who has been there if you have not previously. Trespassing to go to the cave is only stupid and irressponsible with that sort of landowner setup. So here is some information you may not know:

Telford and Luraville are the same cave. Due to the much larger surveyed size of Luraville spring, the entire system is called the Luraville Spring Cave System. As of Jun06, there are 29,000 total feet in the cave system. The original Luraville-Telford connection was made in 1989 by Skiles, et al. and was re-confirmed by John Kunkle in 2000. Since then, John has, in what appears to be a solo effort, established a massive mapping project from the Luraville side which has produced a very nice print map of the Luraville side of the system (not currently publicly available, but is displayed at Cathy's. His map goes as far as the Aardvark room, which is also noted on Sheck's old Telford maps. No newer map of Telford has ever been produced, despite several resurvey efforts. The Luraville side of the cave is mostly low and dark, with some short exceptions, and is best dove with sidemount configurations. Entrance into the system can be tricky depending on water levels (I had to crawl with tanks through dry cave to the water) and visibility can be poor in entrance areas.
For access to this dive site, please call: Kathy Lesh at Dive Outpost: 386-776-1449. Please preserve our hard-won landowner relations.

Jason Richards
07-24-2006 07:51 AM
Line Squirrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradfordNC

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

Who will sit with the vans? I can lend them my ummmm, Glock...I only have 10 round magazines though, the upside is I have hollow points.

Mike,

never knew you were so right wing.

will have to bring my collection next time.

All for the second amendment!! I used to shoot alot up north, gotten away from it last few years. I would like to get back into it though...any good ranges around? I shoot the .45 out back once in a while (another good reason to get permission to dive Luraville, never know when the lead is flying back there) but it drives the dogs nuts.
07-24-2006 10:13 AM
MikeH

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

Who will sit with the vans? I can lend them my ummmm, Glock...I only have 10 round magazines though, the upside is I have hollow points.

You know that you can get hi caps now....right? :-D

Mike
07-24-2006 04:04 PM
JDostal

Yikes!

Sorry about that everyone, I wasn't aware I was sneak diving when I made the dive. I will go about that differently next time.

I'll bring along a few of my pistols - lets go diving and then shoot up the woods over a post dive beer or two :)
07-24-2006 05:33 PM
Capt Tom McMillan

Luraville II ?

Guys and Gals,

I do not have a dog in this fight...

In my humble opinion as a landowner here in the great state of South Carolina. If you do not post "NO TRESPASSING" signs, you might be a red neck, I mean you might not be trespassing if there are no signs present. It might be that Cathy needs to post a couple of signs near the spring or at least on the road. Like I said, I ain't got no dog in this fight, just my opinion. Other more legal minds need to be consulted.
07-24-2006 07:03 PM
Line Squirrel

Re: Luraville II ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt Tom McMillan

Guys and Gals,

I do not have a dog in this fight...

It might be that Cathy needs to post a couple of signs near the spring or at least on the road.

Tom, I know you don't have a pooch in this fight...there is no "fight" but where does it end with the tresspassing thing...

I mean, if I just happen to walk in between your signs and truely do not see them???? am I tresspassing or not??? Of course I am, wether I see posted signs or not or even if there are no signs posted.

Look, if I don't own the land then that means somebody else does, what else needs to be said? You either own the land or you don't, if you don't, then find out who does and ask for permission.

IMHO, of course :-D
07-24-2006 08:21 PM
curtschu

The point

The point is that if land is not fenced or posted then the "crime" of trespass does not occur until you remain or return after given warning by an Autorized party. If the land is posted or fenced then entering is prima faca evendence and an officer may arrest. This is why you see signs offen authorizing the so ans so police to remove persons from said property. That way they don't need to call someone to tell you to leave. Hence giving you warning. REF: FS 810.02 (1) (2B)
07-25-2006 05:20 AM
Line Squirrel

Re: The point

Quote:

Originally Posted by curtschu

The point is that if land is not fenced or posted then the "crime" of trespass does not occur until you remain or return after given warning by an Autorized party. If the land is posted or fenced then entering is prima faca evendence and an officer may arrest. This is why you see signs offen authorizing the so ans so police to remove persons from said property. That way they don't need to call someone to tell you to leave. Hence giving you warning. REF: FS 810.02 (1) (2B)

Interesting, thanks Curt.
07-25-2006 05:24 AM
Line Squirrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omicron

lets go diving and then shoot up the woods over a post dive beer or two :)

LOL, I'll drink with ya and shoot with ya but not both at the same time!!
07-25-2006 09:35 AM
DeWayne

Re: The point

Quote:

Originally Posted by curtschu

The point is that if land is not fenced or posted then the "crime" of trespass does not occur until you remain or return after given warning by an Autorized party. If the land is posted or fenced then entering is prima faca evendence and an officer may arrest. This is why you see signs offen authorizing the so ans so police to remove persons from said property. That way they don't need to call someone to tell you to leave. Hence giving you warning. REF: FS 810.02 (1) (2B)

Many states have adopted laws that do not require fencing nor signs to be posted; if you do not own the land and do not have specified permission from the owner to be on it you are guilty of trespass. If the land is fenced and/or has signs posted or the landowner has specifically forbidden you permission to enter, then you can be charged with trespass after warning. In AL, to hunt on someone else's property (actually, this applies to any time you carry a weapon onto someone's property) you must have written permission on your person or you can be charged with felony trespass. Like Mike said, if you do not own the land find out who does and ask for permission before entering, that will go a long way in keeping relations open to allow others on the property.
07-25-2006 09:57 AM
JDostal

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

LOL, I'll drink with ya and shoot with ya but not both at the same time!!

Sounds good :) I'm used to the Wisconsin attitude. Targets are what the beer was in before you started shooting.
07-25-2006 10:55 AM
curtschu

True

Dwayne this is the same in Florida as far as Armed Trespass. I just stuck to the issue at hand since I think they would be hard pressed to call a z-knife a weapon but heck you never know in North Florida Counties.
The bottom line is if you are climbing fences or opening gates you know you don't belong. Now if you are ridge walking (with permission) and happen to wander into someone's land it stands to reason that you had no intension to break the law and you should be permitted to leave without arrest.
07-25-2006 01:10 PM
JE

Spot On-!

Ok fellows & goils, here is the scoop on Luraville's systems:

Cathy Leash of The Dive Outpost in Luraville is the current property owner of the Luraville cave systems. She is a kind, helpful small business owner who is more than happy to help divers reach their potential goals. All you have to do is to drop in on her when she opens her store, & say hi, 'May we dive your caves'-? At that point she will ask for your training levels & cards, & then may require you to take a guide with you. {Cindy Butler is one such guide} After that, if you are a competent cave diver, you will most likely to be allowed to dive the systems on your own, preferably with a competent buddy-! Luraville is laden with deep silt & mud passageways, & is easy to stir up in a heart beat. {You know, like you can't see your main HID if you hold it in front of your eyes-!} If you are at the level of diving comfortably Solo in an advanced cave system, then you probably will enjoy the experience immensly. Otherwise, take your best buddy with you for safety reasons & back-up contigencys. Be aware, that this is the place where I first encountered 'Bucky'-! Keep your distance from him if you see him, as he could very easily bite you in the ass, & then you would have a problem to work out- :)-! If you are lucky, you'll also see the large fresh-water eels that are abundent thru-out the system, as well as Catfish, & other critters.
By the way, Cathy enjoys having cave divers over during the holidays to share stories with while roasting marshmellows over huge bonfires, during the winter months. So be nice to her & don't spoil it for the rest of us. All you have to do is ask-!

Jack- 8)
07-25-2006 01:22 PM
JDostal

I'll be taking that route in the future - like I said, I wasn't aware it was not open to just walking in and diving it...it wasn't explained to me like that at all. I am a landowner up here in Wisconsin so believe me, the last thing I would be doing is something I myself can't stand.

Looking forward to more dives in that cave. In sidemount it was a blast - lots of fun passage to go through.
07-25-2006 01:31 PM
JE

best wishes 'Omicron'

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omicron

I'll be taking that route in the future - like I said, I wasn't aware it was not open to just walking in and diving it...it wasn't explained to me like that at all. I am a landowner up here in Wisconsin so believe me, the last thing I would be doing is something I myself can't stand.

Looking forward to more dives in that cave. In sidemount it was a blast - lots of fun passage to go through.

I'm sure Wisconsin 'Badgers' would be welcome down here as well-! :) Being from out-of-state, doesn't help one's orientation with the environments down here, as you probably wouldn't know where to draw the lines anyhow. It is just best to always ask first anyways. BTW, I've done a lot of diving thru-out Wisconsin myself, & always enjoyed the variety of dive sites up there. The 'Apostle Islands' & Isle Royale Nat'l Park are my favorites.
Have fun down here, & I wish you good diving

Jack E.
07-25-2006 06:10 PM
MikeH

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omicron

I'll bring along a few of my pistols - lets go diving and then shoot up the woods over a post dive beer or two :)

Don't forget the cigars... Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms. :-D

Mike
07-26-2006 05:11 AM
Line Squirrel

Re: Spot On-!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JE

Ok fellows & goils, here is the scoop on Luraville's systems:

Cathy Leash of The Dive Outpost in Luraville is the current property owner of the Luraville cave systems. She is a kind, helpful small business owner who is more than happy to help divers reach their potential goals. All you have to do is to drop in on her when she opens her store, & say hi, 'May we dive your caves'-? At that point she will ask for your training levels & cards, & then may require you to take a guide with you. {Cindy Butler is one such guide} After that, if you are a competent cave diver, you will most likely to be allowed to dive the systems on your own, preferably with a competent buddy-! Luraville is laden with deep silt & mud passageways, & is easy to stir up in a heart beat. {You know, like you can't see your main HID if you hold it in front of your eyes-!} If you are at the level of diving comfortably Solo in an advanced cave system, then you probably will enjoy the experience immensly. Otherwise, take your best buddy with you for safety reasons & back-up contigencys. Be aware, that this is the place where I first encountered 'Bucky'-! Keep your distance from him if you see him, as he could very easily bite you in the ass, & then you would have a problem to work out- :)-! If you are lucky, you'll also see the large fresh-water eels that are abundent thru-out the system, as well as Catfish, & other critters.
By the way, Cathy enjoys having cave divers over during the holidays to share stories with while roasting marshmellows over huge bonfires, during the winter months. So be nice to her & don't spoil it for the rest of us. All you have to do is ask-!

Jack- 8)

You left out supporting her dive shop, purchasing gas from her once in a while will go a long way in getting access :wink:
07-26-2006 09:59 AM
DeWayne

Re: True

Quote:

Originally Posted by curtschu

Dwayne this is the same in Florida as far as Armed Trespass. I just stuck to the issue at hand since I think they would be hard pressed to call a z-knife a weapon but heck you never know in North Florida Counties.
The bottom line is if you are climbing fences or opening gates you know you don't belong. Now if you are ridge walking (with permission) and happen to wander into someone's land it stands to reason that you had no intension to break the law and you should be permitted to leave without arrest.

I think a lot will depend on who catches you Curt and what they observe you doing. If the law sees you just walking the ridge chances are good you will get off with a warning; if the landowner catches you, he has the right to demand that the law be enforced. It is amazing what can be construed as a weapon (I used to patrol a hunting lease for a friend adjacent to a military installation, boy did I have fun when those Army officers decided to take it to court-they lost every time.) If you cannot look at a topo map, determine who owns the property you wish to explore, and stick to your plans then chances are you should not be out there ridge walking to begin with. Respect for the land extends to he who owns it.
07-26-2006 11:02 AM
Signal 20

any pics of the luraville sinks?????
07-26-2006 12:09 PM
JE

Re: Spot On-!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

You left out supporting her dive shop, purchasing gas from her once in a while will go a long way in getting access :wink:

Hey Richard- :) ??

Oops....you're right, but me thinks the majority of the guys & girls will support her shop as well as have their tanks filled there if needed. I do-! Thanks.

je 8)
07-26-2006 06:22 PM
Cindy

I have a lot of photos but don't have time to dig them out. Anybody want to archive around 1800 photos? Cindy :D
08-02-2006 09:05 AM
metaldector

Minor Correction

TJ says, "I've done a lot of diving thru-out Wisconsin myself, & always enjoyed the variety of dive sites up there. The 'Apostle Islands' & Isle Royale Nat'l Park are my favorites."

Isle Royale Nat'l Park is in Michigan not Wisconsin. Small correction but true.
08-02-2006 05:49 PM
Signal 20

Re: Minor Correction

Quote:

Originally Posted by metaldector

TJ says, "I've done a lot of diving thru-out Wisconsin myself, & always enjoyed the variety of dive sites up there. The 'Apostle Islands' & Isle Royale Nat'l Park are my favorites."

Isle Royale Nat'l Park is in Michigan not Wisconsin. Small correction but true.

i thought this thread was about the luraville cave system....
08-03-2006 10:00 AM
JE

Re: Minor Correction

Supposed to be-! Don't know how TJ's iniatals got into it-?

"I thought this thread was about the
luraville cave system...."?

Then again anyone & everyone seems to add their two cents worth when they feel like it-! It doesn't matter-! Waaaatttttttzzzzzzzzzz ZzuuPP-?

J.

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