Steps at Madison Blue

Did 2 great dives at Madison Blue yesterday, but wanted to mention that the righthand (when facing the water) set of steps to the water is very hazardous. There is a step missing and when I decided (foolishly) to take a big step over the missing step, I was more than surprised that the next step rotated when I stepped on it. I mention this because I'm sure falling while wearing a set of doubles would likely lead to injury of some sort. Fortunately, this is easily avoided by just using the other set of steps.

Is this the kind of thing that volunteers could help fix or will the SP deal with it.?

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Originally Posted by Serota

Did 2 great dives at Madison Blue yesterday, but wanted to mention that the righthand (when facing the water) set of steps to the water is very hazardous. There is a step missing and when I decided (foolishly) to take a big step over the missing step, I was more than surprised that the next step rotated when I stepped on it. I mention this because I'm sure falling while wearing a set of doubles would likely lead to injury of some sort. Fortunately, this is easily avoided by just using the other set of steps.

Is this the kind of thing that volunteers could help fix or will the SP deal with it.?

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You could also do what I do... a giant stride off of the dive platform. :wink:

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Originally Posted by Serota

Is this the kind of thing that volunteers could help fix or will the SP deal with it.?

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I don't know. I believe the steps were like that about 5 yrs ago when I got certified. The park was closed to diving for several years, so I was surprised when I returned and they were still in that condition. I was going to ask the ranger about it, but the ranger was away on other duties when I left the park.

I should think that a SP would be 'responsible' for repairs but maybe volunteers are needed to get it done. I noticed that the left side is getting wobbly also - probably from overuse. Even the swimmers avoid the right side.

After Ann Bruic sold Madison Blue Springs a few years ago, maintaining the stairways hasn't been a priority. It wouldn't surprise me at all to see the stairways torn down and replaced with ladders. When I lasted dived there in November, the right side stairway was roped off and several of the steps in the left side stairway were spongy.

And while we are voicing stairway complaints, I went to Manatee Springs Friday and the steps into Catfish Hotel were kind of wobbly, not going to fail anytime soon but probably on the way to it.

When I think of the steps at Madison Blue, I can't help thinking of the last time I was there. I had a female dive buddy, and a little boy couldn't quite grasp the concept of a cave-diving woman.

She already had her mask and hood on when he swam up to within six inches of her face and demanded, "Are you a boy or a girl?"

I was at Madison late last month and the right side facing the water was roped off. Sounds like they took the rope down, but did nothing else. And yes, the left side is spongy too. Made me a little nervous going up and down. I tried to stay to the edges thinking that area would be stronger, but who knows.

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Originally Posted by Sludge

When I think of the steps at Madison Blue, I can't help thinking of the last time I was there. I had a female dive buddy, and a little boy couldn't quite grasp the concept of a cave-diving woman.

She already had her mask and hood on when he swam up to within six inches of her face and demanded, "Are you a boy or a girl?"

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Ohhhh that's funny. I get that question sometimes too after I'm geared up.

i've only dove Madison once and it was over a year ago, but i remember the stairs being very slippery. my buddy slipped and fell pretty hard on the platform. he wasnt hurt so i didnt feel bad laughing my ass off at him. wont mention any names though

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Originally Posted by Tegg

You could also do what I do... a giant stride off of the dive platform. :wink:

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That's an excellent idea - I think it would be safer than the steps and if you had no air in your wing, you could be at the entrance in no time at all!

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Originally Posted by Serota

That's an excellent idea - I think it would be safer than the steps and if you had no air in your wing, you could be at the entrance in no time at all!

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Heck........>just roll in head first & do a somersault, but keep some air in your wing just in case- :) We used to do this off P-1 + the OG before they built stairs-! Long as you have everything bungied & no danglees, you'll be fine, & it's a lot of fun, too. Scares the heck out of the critters though, including the gators- 8)

Yak

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Originally Posted by Sludge

When I think of the steps at Madison Blue, I can't help thinking of the last time I was there. I had a female dive buddy, and a little boy couldn't quite grasp the concept of a cave-diving woman.

She already had her mask and hood on when he swam up to within six inches of her face and demanded, "Are you a boy or a girl?"

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Thats why I don't wear a hood !!! :-D

Btw: When we dove Madison on Sunday , I noticed that missing STEP on the right side...I tried to get up that thing with my gear on and it was quite a trick...I used the left side steps the rest of the day....

Yes , I wonder if we could fix that for them...

Jean

P.S. Marcy and I were doing our Deco stop and there were so many swimmers jumping off of the diving deck that we got a good show from the jumpers!!!

it was a safety stop, jean! you scared one of my buddies with this post.

the swimmers/jumpers were actually very considerate, and stopped for a while since they were worried they'd hit us jumping. fun to watch! and the snails fascinate me for some reason.

and yes, the steps really bite. slippery, too. and as long as i'm whining, the benches need to be deeper so i don't have to rope my gear on with cave line. though it was a cool new use for it...

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Originally Posted by Serota

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Originally Posted by Tegg

You could also do what I do... a giant stride off of the dive platform. :wink:

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That's an excellent idea - I think it would be safer than the steps and if you had no air in your wing, you could be at the entrance in no time at all!

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In a set of doubles that would be a hell of a cannon ball! Say 9.2 or better. :lol:

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Originally Posted by BabyDuck

it was a safety stop, jean! you scared one of my buddies with this post.

the swimmers/jumpers were actually very considerate, and stopped for a while since they were worried they'd hit us jumping. fun to watch! and the snails fascinate me for some reason.

and yes, the steps really bite. slippery, too. and as long as i'm whining, the benches need to be deeper so i don't have to rope my gear on with cave line. though it was a cool new use for it...

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Whining accepted !!!!
Sorry (slaps herself...)
Safety Stop ... :-D :-D :-D

P.S. Hey , I though "roping" our gear was a very clever idea. I can just see a set of doubles falling over , landing on the valves ... :oops:

Jeano Beano

You have to wonder why the State gives a concession to a private business - but then doesn't require them to maintain the place in return for their shot at making money (especially off divers!)

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Originally Posted by Genesis

You have to wonder why the State gives a concession to a private business - but then doesn't require them to maintain the place in return for their shot at making money (especially off divers!)

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Concession contract ran out a while ago, no more "American Canoe" running the place. Been operated/maintained by the park service since May 2005. I'm assuming it's a budget thing now, it may be that once they start working on the stairs they might have to be made ADA accessable?????

But those are the steps the Bruics put in, right? American Canoe had the contract for how long? If it is a budget thing then the park just needs to say so and the Cave Community is going to step up, You Know That!!

Mike, since you are on the inside why don't you find out for us and I'm sure we can remedy the issue. IE: pony up the cash. It is in our best interest to have good safe stairs.

Curt

There is no ADA issue with making repairs. If you modify the design (as opposed to fixing the steps) then you can run into the problem of changed regs......

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Originally Posted by curtschu

If it is a buget thing then the park just needs to say so and the Cave Community is going to step up, You Know That!!

Mike Since you are on the inside why don't you find out for us and I'm sure we can remedy the issue. IE: pony up the cash. It is in our best interest to have good safe stairs.

Curt

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Agreed

DEP is very limited to the materials which can be used today that can go under water on a regular basis. Has anyone expressed their safety concern to park employees?
Janet

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Originally Posted by Jason B.

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Originally Posted by curtschu

If it is a buget thing then the park just needs to say so and the Cave Community is going to step up, You Know That!!

Mike Since you are on the inside why don't you find out for us and I'm sure we can remedy the issue. IE: pony up the cash. It is in our best interest to have good safe stairs.

Curt

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Agreed

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They need to hear from YOU...not from me. Here, I'll help ya'all out:

http://floridastateparks.org/communi...orm=ReportCard

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Originally Posted by mmcauliffe

They need to hear from YOU...not from me. Here, I'll help ya'all out:

http://floridastateparks.org/communi...orm=ReportCard

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Thanks, I sent one.

i did, too. thanks, mike!

pet bug for me, please.

ALCON,

Both sides of steps are now broken. It is an adventure getting out of the pool now.

Ben

Thanks Mike


(i put one in for Janet too :-)

Good stuff honestly :-D

Sent one also.

Yes , quite an adventure trying to get out of Madison yesterday (06/10). The diving was awesome , but the steps , well , not so awesome !!!!
I am going to Peacock today so I'll mention it to Janet in passing too.

Thanks!
Jean

ok, i sent one

both sides busted now huh? dang. i hope they get it fixed soon. i want to dive there next weekend, but don't realy want the extra adventure of the olympic games.

Dove there saturday GREAT site. I sent one also. Thanks for making it easy Richard

as far as ADA, if the repair or replacement cost is more than $500 dollars is has to be ADA compliant, as far as structural ada guidelines go and i assume stairs regardless of what they lead to would be considered structural. i only know this because that's basically all my major is about(or that's what it seems like.)

I have a feeling that since the steps were built before the DEP obtained the park,that the general rules about lumber and surface water didn't apply. There may be some benefit in repairing them because there is less of a bureaucratic nightmare,but maybe initiate a plan to replace them. The state has many requirements for building materials near water sources such as pressure treated lumber without arsenic or copper. Using the artificial materials (name escapes me right now) is more expensive, very durable,and readily accepted. Also,frequently a building project like this has to be approved by an engineer. It is easy to call park management to complain about this problem,because I agree the stairs have been in severe disrepair longer than this;but you'll be more appreciated approaching it as can I help with this problem-just my .02 worth. In another thread somebody mentioned the CSO. Join their group and say lets help raise money to do this,it may speed the process up,and a vote on appreciation to the cave diving community will be expressed.

Well, I was going to replace some of the stairs....looks like I'll just try to repair them as best I can...

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Originally Posted by DogDiver

Well, I was going to replace some of the stairs....looks like I'll just try to repair them as best I can...

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Why don't you talk to park management and offer your help. The parks really appreciate the help of their volunteers.

I did a repair job on both sides of the stairs at Madison. We cave divers got a big thanks from Ranger Kim. Ya know, an air impact gun works great on 32% nitrox from a stage bottle. Sorry I didn't adhere the the thirds and drained the cylinder down to 250 #. Oh, well.

I talked to Ranger Kim, while I was there. The stairs at the Marntz entry will be reinforced soon and added. The main spring stairs and platform will be replaced by the park system sometime in July this year...lol... The funds have been approved by the state and she has a contractor so things should go quickly.

The Madison Blue CSO is with Suwannee River State Park CSO. Lets all help out and work to make Madison like Peacock Springs.

Dog Diver ( I'd call you by your real name if I knew it )
I appricate your efforts!
Thank You.
Tom Hundley

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Originally Posted by DogDiver

I did a repair job on both sides of the stairs at Madison. We cave divers got a big thanks from Ranger Kim. Ya know, an air impact gun works great on 32% nitrox from a stage bottle. Sorry I didn't adhere the the thirds and drained the cylinder down to 250 #. Oh, well.

I talked to Ranger Kim, while I was there. The stairs at the Marntz entry will be reinforced soon and added. The main spring stairs and platform will be replaced by the park system sometime in July this year...lol... The funds have been approved by the state and she has a contractor so things should go quickly.

The Madison Blue CSO is with Suwannee River State Park CSO. Lets all help out and work to make Madison like Peacock Springs.

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That is a truely awesome act! Thank you so much.

Ben

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Originally Posted by kuster500

That is a truely awesome act! Thank you so much.

Ben

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Yes it is ... Thank you so much DogDiver !!!!
Way to go ...

Well Ben , looks like easier walking down dem steps...
I am no good with hammers etc , but I would LOVE to help contribute to putting up some tank stands like there are at Peacock !!!!
Those are SO NICE !!!!

Jean

ada boy on the repair job and
same here and im in tally so when i can help someone please contact me

Thank you so much for doing the step repairs. I knew you would like our ranger Kim. Just an aside, Ranger Kim collects cave diving photos. She has almost 800 and has never been in a cave. We need to take her some time. Cindy :D

You rock DogDiver! We'll let you slide for cheating thirds on this job no sweat! :wink:
Again, thanks!

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Originally Posted by Cindy

Thank you so much for doing the step repairs. I knew you would like our ranger Kim. Just an aside, Ranger Kim collects cave diving photos. She has almost 800 and has never been in a cave. We need to take her some time. Cindy :D

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Yes we do !!!
I am going to have to stop up there and talk to Kim ...

Jean

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Originally Posted by Cindy

I knew you would like our ranger Kim. Just an aside, Ranger Kim collects cave diving photos. She has almost 800 and has never been in a cave. We need to take her some time. Cindy :D

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does she dive at all?

I don't even think she snorkles. I was thinking of taking her into a "dry cave" first and working her up to the water filled ones later. Cindy :D

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Originally Posted by Cindy

I was thinking of taking her into a "dry cave" first and working her up to the water filled ones later. Cindy :D

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Careful there....A couple years ago, Marbry chastised me for calling it a "dry cave". He told me it's just a "not as wet" cave... :-D

Mike

The ranger Kim Harrs is a sweetheart. The last time I was there, she asked us if there was anything that we could suggest to improve conditions for us. She already planned on repairing the stairs, but we also suggested an extra step or two in Martz, and a railing that extended farther towards the water in there on the left side, and she said she would put that on the request. She also loves cave diving photos, and I have emailed her a bunch.

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Originally Posted by John L.

She also loves cave diving photos, and I have emailed her a bunch.

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John speaking of photos, how are your doing with your video camera? I'd like to see some of your footage.
Tom

wonderful! thanks both for the repairs and for telling the forum about it. you rock!! but i can't agree with jason - go to diver jail for breaking thirds... 8)

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Originally Posted by BabyDuck

wonderful! thanks both for the repairs and for telling the forum about it. you rock!! but i can't agree with jason - go to diver jail for breaking thirds... 8)

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Now , now , no breaking thirds !!! :o :o :o

Jeano Beano

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Originally Posted by tomhauburn

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Originally Posted by John L.

She also loves cave diving photos, and I have emailed her a bunch.

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John speaking of photos, how are your doing with your video camera? I'd like to see some of your footage.
Tom

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Hey Tom,
I have shot some real good footage. Working on getting a new computer and some editing software so I can put music to them, and edit out some dull points.

Once I get everything situated with my video editing, I plan on shooting videos of divers on their favorite cave dive, and put whatever tunes they want on it.

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Originally Posted by John L.

Once I get everything situated with my video editing, I plan on shooting videos of divers on their favorite cave dive, and put whatever tunes they want on it.

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John I am looking forward to it. Sorry about hijacking the thread. Once again thanks to Dog Diver for the repairs. Hopefully I'll get up there soon and it will not be blown out by the recent rain.
Tom