Shangri-La Springs on Merritt's Millpond

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03-07-2006 09:30 PM
Guy Bryant

Shangri-La Springs on Merritt's Millpond

I was out at the Millpond this past weekend and decided to dive Shangri-La since I have never dived it. I've known about it since the late 70's but never dived it since there were so many "big tunnel" caves to dive. I took my 95 sidemounts and went back through the tight restriction to the main line. Once at the main line I realize my profile was too big with the 95's for a comfortable dive. I got temporarily stuck for about 15 mins before I was finally able to back out (too small to turn-around). I'm thinking of going back with steel 72 sidemounts, but before I do does anyone know how much line is in this system? If so, is it worth seeing? I don't want to waste my time if there is not much to see. Thanks for any help.
Guy
03-07-2006 09:45 PM
Signal 20

Re: Shangri-La Springs on Merritt's Millpond

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Bryant

I got temporarily stuck for about 15 mins before I was finally able to back out (too small to turn-around).

you got stuck for 15 minutes? i've gotten into some small places that i probably shouldnt have been but i dont think 15 minutes of being stuck in a restriction is normal :wink:
03-07-2006 09:53 PM
Guy Bryant

I didn't exactly spend the whole 15min trying to get unstuck. I had my camera with me and decided to take some photos of the area inbetween trying to back out. My 1st attempt was unsuccessful so I went back to the main line took some photos, tried removing my tanks and turning around. This didn't work so I put them back on, took some more photos then tried backing out again at a very slow and methodical pace. This time I was able to back out - it is not a straight line backing out, you have to turn some and go upward at one point as you back out. From the time I started into the restriction, got to the main line, attempted to back out, took pictures, removed tanks to try and turnaround, put tanks back on and finally successfully back out, the time spent was 15 min.
03-08-2006 06:57 AM
BillGraham

It's really just barely a sidemount cave.

My friend went in there with a makeshift no mount rig and no fins, and had a wonderful time, so that might be a better option.

We dove it together in sidemount and I got stuck on the way back out while he snickered behind me.
03-08-2006 08:39 AM
Guy Bryant

Bill,
I might have to try no mount if there is something to see. How far does the line go?? I talked with Paul Deloach and he said he and Sheck tried to dive it years ago and had the same problem I did. Paul seems to think there is a possibility of it connecting to Jackson Blue. Did you go to the end of the line or do you know if it may connect with Jackson Blue?
Guy
03-08-2006 01:40 PM
DeWayne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Bryant

Bill,
I might have to try no mount if there is something to see. How far does the line go?? I talked with Paul Deloach and he said he and Sheck tried to dive it years ago and had the same problem I did. Paul seems to think there is a possibility of it connecting to Jackson Blue. Did you go to the end of the line or do you know if it may connect with Jackson Blue?
Guy

I have never heard of anyone getting in there far enough to make the connection theory seem plausible, but who knows. Most that I have ever talked to about it seem to think that no mount is the only way you will ever get very far in there. I have no idea how far it might go, but from what I have heard it does go and it is worth the effort, it is just that effort is the key word. I hope you will post your findings if you attempt it.
03-09-2006 07:48 AM
BillGraham

Maybe it does but you'd better find a way to shrink yourself down to G.I. Joe size to make that happen. :-D

There's also another crack that you go over just as you approach the cavern area.
03-09-2006 09:45 AM
Chunky

there are some groups working on small electronic control mechanisms that they have gotten to work with cockroaches. They can control them almost like a remote controlled car. Maybe they can make a housing for it with a long tether and we can send some of the lobsters in there with a small video camera.....

:D
03-09-2006 02:23 PM
muzz

Can they use some of the crayfish from Mill Pond or are they too big?
03-09-2006 03:07 PM
Chunky

Sorry, thats what I meant by "lobsters"....
03-11-2006 08:44 PM
lonestarfl

Re: Shangri-La Springs on Merritt's Millpond

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Bryant

I was out at the Millpond this past weekend and decided to dive Shangri-La since I have never dived it. I've known about it since the late 70's but never dived it since there were so many "big tunnel" caves to dive. I took my 95 sidemounts and went back through the tight restriction to the main line. Once at the main line I realize my profile was too big with the 95's for a comfortable dive. I got temporarily stuck for about 15 mins before I was finally able to back out (too small to turn-around). I'm thinking of going back with steel 72 sidemounts, but before I do does anyone know how much line is in this system? If so, is it worth seeing? I don't want to waste my time if there is not much to see. Thanks for any help.
Guy

Guy,
PM sent.
Lee
03-11-2006 09:29 PM
CaptainSpeleo

Lee:

I already know what you're thinking about that site. I'll stick with Twin Caves and Hole In The Wall.

Barring any unforeseen circumstances, I'll be at your house on the afternoon of Saturday, the 25th, for a couple of days of diving.

Frank
03-13-2006 06:13 PM
Scott Hunsucker

Tighest dive I have ever made

Many years ago Ward and I took the end of the line in Shangra-la after much effort. Bar-none it was the tightest and smallest cave I have ever squeezed through (though I must say the old bathroom restriction in JB is by-far the worst single restriction). There were many points that our heads had to be turned sideways in order to proceed and we were unable to right them for the distance of the passage.

When not busy contemplating taking another breath, to avoid painful chest expansion, or trying to fit through the pit restriction, it is a beautiful cave. Perfect for no-mounting, the only way past the final restricition, given the hard rock floor and the flow. I wore an old one piece 3mil just to decrease the abrasions as I found any other suit was just to thick.

While the final pit is an anomaly, and is quite beautiful, I, in good conscious, can not recommend the dive given the extreme nature of the pit restriction.
Scott Hunsucker
03-14-2006 10:38 AM
Chunky

Sounds like some place I'd end up getting my fat gut stuck in...

at least the crawfish would have a feast if that happened...
03-14-2006 10:39 AM
Chunky

Is there a map of the system? I have no intention of going in there. I just like to look at the maps...:)
03-14-2006 01:03 PM
Ward Beecher

We didn't make one and I have never seen one. If I see you in Marianna or Houston, I will sketch you one. It is a very simple cave, no side passages. PM me for more info.

Ward
03-15-2006 03:03 PM
Chunky

So how does one go about learning how to dive no mount? Is this something covered in a sidemount class or just something people try after building up experience in sidemount? Is there any official training courses in no-mount?

Martin.
03-15-2006 05:26 PM
DeWayne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chunky

So how does one go about learning how to dive no mount? Is this something covered in a sidemount class or just something people try after building up experience in sidemount? Is there any official training courses in no-mount?

Martin.

It is one of those techniques where a mentor comes in handy. Most of those I have known who have gone no mount did so after years of tight sm passages, and it was sort of a natural extension for them to be able to see the rest of the cave. I have not met too many who would list it as their favorite set up to dive.
03-15-2006 05:45 PM
Guy Bryant

I don't know of any course in no mount. You just grab a tank and hold it in you hands and push it in front of you. It helps to have some harness webbing running from the tank valve to near the bottom. This will allow you to grab the tank from many positions. If the tank is heavy you can always rubber band a pvc tube to it with bands made from inner tube. This will make the tank more neutral. Also, have a way to clip it on to your BC or harness for those areas where it no longer requires you to use this method.

I used this method in 1983 in Madison Blue, except for the PVC tube. If you go back to the main line in Madison and look over to the right as you head toward the Godzilla Room jump you will see a small hole in the floor. There is a line running down this tunnel. I used a single 72 with the no mount method to put this line in. It only goes about 300ft before it loops back to the main line. If you want to try no mount give this tunnel a go - at least you know that you will not have to turn around or back out of such a small tunnel as you will exit the tunnel at the main line. It comes back out at the first drop off area in the main tunnel. Look over to the right in a corner and you will see a line tied off on the ceiling area of a small syphoning tunnel.

Have fun.
03-16-2006 07:57 AM
Line Squirrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeWayne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chunky

So how does one go about learning how to dive no mount? Is this something covered in a sidemount class or just something people try after building up experience in sidemount? Is there any official training courses in no-mount?

Martin.

It is one of those techniques where a mentor comes in handy. Most of those I have known who have gone no mount did so after years of tight sm passages, and it was sort of a natural extension for them to be able to see the rest of the cave. I have not met too many who would list it as their favorite set up to dive.

Brian Kakuk has a section on no mount diving and gear configuration in his IANTD student manual. I am in no way advocating reading the book and hitting the water, but it may answer some of your questions and help you decide if it something you want to take a class in or get mentoring from a very experienced diver.
Brian and I discussed (briefly) no mount in my sidemount class a couple years ago. I say briefly because at the time, no mount was something I only had a passing curiosity in at best. Now....I'm still not ready for something that tight, but I seem to be slowly but surely heading in that direction.
Anyway, take a look at the manual, it's worth a look.
03-16-2006 08:09 AM
BillGraham

You can't go wrong with the advice of the guys with a billion dives in the pond, listen to them!

I looked back at my notes of the one dive I did in there last year: "small cavern-- line drops down through hole in the floor, opens into tight horizontal crack sidemount only. Gets really tight at first T."

I remember stopping there while my buddy unclipped one tank and pushed in a little further. I also remember having to turn my head sideways to fit and that did freak me out.
03-16-2006 09:52 AM
Chunky

Thanks for the info guys!

I am in no way ready to go into no mount, especially since I have not done side mount yet either... I was just curious since I have not seen info on no mounting....

Thanks again!

Martin.
03-17-2006 07:05 PM
lonestarfl

no mount

I prefer my limit to be sidemount diving. For me no mount is what I do if I get REALLY stuck in sidemount and need to make an exit.
But, if I were to actually go on a no mount dive I would be sure of two things. First, be comfortable with a SOLO diving mentality. Secondly, I would always keep the no mount bottle on a "leash" that was shorter than my breathing hose.
Safe Diving,
Lee