Whitewater Diving - Jackson Blue

So, yeah....it's about as high as I could imagine flow being. Vis was alright, but kinda full of sediment the flow was kicking up. Maybe 80ft of vis, but there was a definite particulate buildup. For the flow: crazy strong. Even pulling yourself into the cave from the deco room is a pain. Coming out was a chore. Reeling up my primary was "fun" in a miserable kind of way. From the deco room to the chimney was fine. The chimney had high flow. I normally descend really quickly down the chimney (with no lead) but had a hard time descending....I had to fin down. Weird. Edd said it was the highest he had seen it in a very long time. It was almost unenjoyable amounts of flow...but it was great for practice.

A Magnus will help negate the flow!!! Edd might even have them in stock!!

I'll make you a deal....you send me a check for a Magnus and I'll GLADLY use it in JB. Heck, I'll even pay for a scooter COURSE....but a scooter won't go over well with the fiancee :D

Having said that, even a scooter would be interesting in JB. On the way in you'd be fine, but the way out could get interesting.

When the flow's up I keep the pitch on 7 for a ripping exit!

If you want some high flow in that area go check out Ebro Blue. I went and tried to dive it today. The flow is ripping. With 2 stages and a scooter it was all I could do to get in the cave. There is sediment and sand blowing in the cave and the viz sucked for scootering.

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Originally Posted by victorzamora

: crazy strong. .

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crazy strong= normal JB (anything less is JB in an imperiled state)

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Originally Posted by Slüdge

When the flow's up I keep the pitch on 7 for a ripping exit!

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Unfortunately there have people who have done that in the past going up the chimney,and this has caused a couple AGEs.

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Originally Posted by GeorgiaDoc

A Magnus will help negate the flow!!! Edd might even have them in stock!!

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Dove with Edd Fri, we both had a Magnus. Most of the time going in I was on speed three to make sufficient progress, took 15 min. to get to the trash room.

So, just to throw an update on here: I dove to the second breakdown on thirds. Turned at 2400 in both tanks. Without finning ONCE on the way out, I was done with my safety stop and had 2100/2000 left in my tanks. I took video of the process, and I'll try to compare times and get an average flow speed down the gold line.

My buddy and I went to JB today and were expecting flow of epic proportions :-)
Actually there is flow, but compared to the flow at Ginnie or Little River I found it to be moderate at best.
We did pull ourselves from the deco room into the main cavern, although it wasn't really necessary. The horseshoe circuit was almost without flow, the Young siphon was siphoning just a bit, parallel lines was flow-free. Flow between the 1st and 2nd breakdown was not that strong at all.
There were several cave classes going on where people seemed to do fine laying line and doing drills.
So in effect I would say as of today conditions are very good, as is the visibility, which is fine as usual.

Guess you are back for sone diving, how long do you stay, planning a trip die. To luraville next weekend, let me know if you are around.

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Originally Posted by huxley

Guess you are back for sone diving, how long do you stay, planning a trip die. To luraville next weekend, let me know if you are around.

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He's going to dive with me right after I turn 18.

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Originally Posted by nakatomi

My buddy and I went to JB today and were expecting flow of epic proportions :-)
Actually there is flow, but compared to the flow at Ginnie or Little River I found it to be moderate at best.
We did pull ourselves from the deco room into the main cavern, although it wasn't really necessary. The horseshoe circuit was almost without flow, the Young siphon was siphoning just a bit, parallel lines was flow-free. Flow between the 1st and 2nd breakdown was not that strong at all.
There were several cave classes going on where people seemed to do fine laying line and doing drills.
So in effect I would say as of today conditions are very good, as is the visibility, which is fine as usual.

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Most people have not been taught how to avoid flow by simply reading the cave.

The flow must've gone down, as there was no easy way in when I was there. Either that, or it's just a difference in experience. I've never been to Ginnie, so it's not like I have high flow caves to compare it to. My other caves have been Twin Cave and Hole in the Wall. It was just MUCH higher than it has been in the past....and that was confirmed by multiple instructors independently.

SuprBugman: I'm a fluid dynamicist, so flow patterns come very naturally to me. Taught or not, I'm at least mildly competent at it.

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Originally Posted by victorzamora

It was just MUCH higher than it has been in the past....and that was confirmed by multiple instructors independently.

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You certainly are correct, it was much higher than I've experienced it on previous trips to JB. Hole in the Wall also has some flow in the entrance area now, although not so much in the big passages below. Twin has very little flow at the moment.

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Originally Posted by victorzamora

The flow must've gone down, as there was no easy way in when I was there. Either that, or it's just a difference in experience. I've never been to Ginnie, so it's not like I have high flow caves to compare it to. My other caves have been Twin Cave and Hole in the Wall. It was just MUCH higher than it has been in the past....and that was confirmed by multiple instructors independently.

SuprBugman: I'm a fluid dynamicist, so flow patterns come very naturally to me. Taught or not, I'm at least mildly competent at it.

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Applying fluid dynamics to your diving may require a bit more than the texts you learned on in school... they are no substitute for mentorship and/or experience.

I also wonder how many instructors out there were instructing 5-6 years ago when the current high flow was simply, normal flow... then again, memories are short anyway, especially after the pampering we've had at JB over the last several years.

Victor,
You owe yourself a dive in LR and Ginnie. I don't know why, but I really like LR, more so then even Ginnie. I feel sure it's because all you have to do is show up and dive. The less the Bureaucracy, the more I like things.

I think the flow has subsided in JB due possibly to the level of the Mill Pond, which is high. I don't understand how the level of the Mill Pond could raise as it's controlled by a Dam that seems to be always closed. I assume the flow out of JB is so high it has simply over whelmed the spillway?
The level of the Mill Pond is / was a little over the wall where the ladder is.

Oh and William, 18 or not I'm still diving in an overhead whenever you do. It's not up to either of us, it's your Mother you have to convince. Remember she said quite a long time ago that your not allowed in a cave, for any reason, so I wouldn't bring it up if I were you. It's best to not tug on Superman's cape.

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Originally Posted by a64pilot

Oh and William, 18 or not I'm still diving in an overhead whenever you do. It's not up to either of us, it's your Mother you have to convince. Remember she said quite a long time ago that your not allowed in a cave, for any reason, so I wouldn't bring it up if I were you. It's best to not tug on Superman's cape.

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Yeah, and I'm not going to try to convince her.

Yeah, I'll be headed down that way soon enough...I just need a reason to go over there instead of Marianna. I might have found one, so we'll see.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S4 using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by victorzamora

Yeah, I'll be headed down that way soon enough...I just need a reason to go over there instead of Marianna. I might have found one, so we'll see.

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REACT.

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Originally Posted by GeorgiaDoc

A Magnus will help negate the flow!!! Edd might even have them in stock!!

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I have a Magnus for sale at a reasonable price that has conquered JB more than once.

I dived Jackson Blue yesterday, so here are a few random thoughts:

My first dive was to scooter the main line to the Source Nouveau Tunnel and back. After the dive I mentioned to someone that although the flow was up in the front of the cave, it wasn't that bad past around p1,500' or so. In fact, when I got back to the Trash Room I got off the trigger and drifted the length of the room - there didn't seem to be much flow at all.

Then for my second dive I dropped my scooter at the King's Bypass and swam the Canyon - very little flow here, of course, but then I decided to swim to the two memorials at the third T, and then take the upper route to the Stoplight. There was really a lot of flow here, and the last fifty feet before the Stoplight really surprised me.

Regarding the millpond's level, I have heard conflicting explanations, but here is what I have observed over the years: when the flow is up, the water level is up. When the flow is down, the water level is down. It seems the three miles from the spring to the dam is far enough that the water level at the spring is directly relative to the flow. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Oh, and the cave is really spitting the water out. I like to do my last deco at 10', out under the diving board, but the flow was kicking me out into the shrubbery (whatever that tall monkey grass stuff is.)

Years ago a diver told me he was pulling his reel at midnight in high flow. His old ginnie light was pretty much out so he figured the flow would push him out and a backup light wasn't needed. He was only at 10-15 feet. What could happen?
Long story short, he wound up at the fence. Should have started running the reel at the picnic table I guess.

The price tag on those damn things are so irritating.

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Originally Posted by stabservo

The price tag on those damn things are so irritating.

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Scooters, fences, reels, lights?

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Originally Posted by a64pilot

Scooters, fences, reels, lights?

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Yes. Yes they are.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S4 using Tapatalk

Yes, scooter and lights and all of the above. Sorry that would have made more sense properly quoted. :)

I got a dive in at JB today and the flow was just like I remember it from 2005, wicked. I just relaxed and took my time crawling in, after all I had already arrived at my destination...underwater!

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Originally Posted by stabservo

The price tag on those damn things are so irritating.

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Yes, they are, but if you remove the tag before using them it's much less irritating.

skip

Anyone planning on diving JB Friday afternoon?

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Originally Posted by a64pilot

...It's not up to either of us, it's your Mother you have to convince... so I wouldn't bring it up if I were you. It's best to not tug on Superman's cape.

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Truer words were never spoken:)

Is anyone planning on some Black Friday diving at JB?