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Who here has ACTUALLY BEEN BITTEN by a Water Moccasin (Cottonmouth)?
Tell us the story...PLEASE
I hear all kinds of stories about how they have, or their buddy has, or they know a guy that knows a guy that knows a long lost uncle that got chased by 25 Cottonmouths (Water Moccasin)...yadda yadda yadda.
Let's put this to a rest.
Who among us as ACTUALLY BEEN BITTEN by water Moccasin AKA: Cottonmouth??? AND can back the story up with factual proof???
I've had them come toward me unprovoked three times. But I can run FAST!
So you have not been bitten by a Water Moccasin.
I've yet to meet anyone. They get scared easily and flee in water since they are more mobile than on land. I've seen several come towards people while growing up going to the springs/rivers, but never seen one actually bite, usually they just swim towards the person to get out of the weeds they're in, then go the other way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Line Squirrel
I was chased (along with my brother) by a pair of them as a kid. When I say "kid" I mean 14. So old enough to remember and realize the situation. I didn't get bit because I ran and put the business end of a shotgun between us and them. My dad was bit by a mocassin while crossing a stream, but was wearing snake boots.
I've never been bitten by a shark, but that doesn't mean I'm going to season myself up and hop in the water with a GW. I think we can all logically deduce the outcome without the need for someone else's first hand account.
So you've never been bitten by one of these snakes that "chase" people down either.
Do you not get where I'm going here?
Just by shear odd's alone surely there must be dozen's of people here that have gotten bitten.
Its coming right for us!!!
OK, so they weren't actually "chasing" you....they were attempting to flee.Quote:
Originally Posted by jj1987
lol - exactlyQuote:
Originally Posted by hunabku
If that makes you feel better to believe that Water Moccasins are not aggressive, don't worry, be happy. The rest of us that grew up walking and hunting in the swamps, know better. I have had one fall out of a tree into the canoe, then come after me, moving very quickly. They are territorial this time of year as well, I have no idea why, but do know they will chase you this time of year. Will they bite if you stood your ground? I have no idea as I have never stood my ground.
lol - Moccasins don't climb trees. That was a Brown water snake.
So this aggressive snake was in your boat, this small confined area, attacked you but still, you never got bit?
I never said they weren't aggressive when provoked. What I'm saying it they don't intentionally "chase" people just for the sake of biting someone like a lot of people here have claimed.
Interesting you mention that. I was diving a river cave a few weekends ago,and I was going to put in a secondary tie off in the cavern,and sticking 4" out from the rock I was going to use was a water moccasin. None the less,found another placement.
So you've never been bitten either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly Jessop
They do climb trees, at least a couple of feet into small trees, I didn't get bit as I destroyed the paddle killing the snake.
I've also been told they can't bite underwater either because they would drown if the opened their mouth underwater. Have you ever heard that?
I've never been "chased" by any snake. I have stood there and had them haul ass right between my legs though.
This is what I do when I'm not diving, so yeah, I spend a lot of time in swamps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bwXinLdoDQ
ETA: I've never seen a cottonmouth in a tree either. I did find a ball python in a tree in this same swamp about five years ago though. Still have him.
must change title of thread..... cant use three donts in the title or it will not go to the second page
Nope but I have heard that turkey farmers won't let the turkeys out when it's raining because the raindrops hitting them on the head makes them look up and they will drown with the raindrops running down their nostrils lolQuote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot
Look up ANY authority on snakes, Moccasins do not climb trees, they like being low and near the water (hence their name). Climbing a foot or two off the ground onto/into a tangle of Cypress roots hardly constitutes climbing a tree.
Moccasins are probably THE MOST miss identified snake in the US. Everybody wants to think they saw a Moccasin. I worked at two (and lived at another) Florida State Parks so I've heard it all before. That entire time I saw ONE positivley identified Moccasin and dozens if not a hundred that were miss identified.
Well, I know where you can find one and make sissies out of a few of us.
So, even though you spend a significant amount of your leasure time in swamps, you've...Quote:
Originally Posted by hunabku
A) Never been "chased" by snake much less attacked by a Moccasin. Further, you've never been bitten by one.
B) Never seen a Moccasin in a tree
I fixed it. Folks, try to remember when you start a thread, don't end the title with an elipse (...) or the thread won't go to Page 2.Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJersey
Also, you can set up your preferences to allow up to fifty posts per page.
That is correct. Chased being the operative word. If you just stand there a snake that is "chasing" you will "chase" right past you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Line Squirrel
I must confess that when I know where one is, I avoid the immediate area.
It's not because I am a "sissy". It is because I am not a "dummy".
And I think that most of these "attacks" are just that, the snake trying to get away from what it thinks is a threat. Sometimes it's just trying to get to the water and the shortest distance may be between your legs lol. If it wasn't beaten to death with a nine iron first, it would have just kept going right on by.Quote:
Originally Posted by hunabku
My grandmother was walking in the backyard and got bit by a cottonmouth on her ankle. She had a nasty scar and chronic pain in that joint for the rest of her life.
The best man at my wedding was bitten a few years back. He was walking along a river bank ankle deep in water (at dusk) and stepped on a WM. it bit him. He then drove himself to the nearest hospital which was 3 hours away (Texas). When he got out he said his entire leg was twice the size of his other leg. He spent about 3 to 4 weeks in said hospital recovering.
I've never been bitten, and having lived in the desert in Arizona for many years, have seen my share...but they stay away from you if you make enough noise.
You just need to carry a rabbit with you. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eqy8YwNSUvY
Here's some info about the snake: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/herpetology...onpconanti.htm
suggests it is has gotten the bad rap as aggressive because of the open mouth threat response. The miami venom response database goes through 2008 and there is info there on wm snake bites:
http://www.miamidade.gov/fire/librar...m-response.pdf has some interesting data, it was up an running in 2001 and the data through 2008 suggests about 8.5 human bites per year from wm. August 2005 was a bad month with 5 and it looks like Broward county is where the majority take place. Bill
I used to kill them constantly during spring bass bed season when I was a kid. Those things were everywhere when walking around the banks looking for bass spawning beds. Out of all the cotton mouths I've killed I've only had a very few actually get aggressive and try to bite me instead of running away.
They actually taste better than the bass I was fishing for :P
I had seen that rabbit video before, and think it is an excellent example of atypical animal behavior, Monty Python aside, I'm not concerned about rabbits as they aren't "armed", but wild animals are just that, and they may or may not act like you want them to.Those of you that believe that a cotton mouth when it opens it's mouth and hisses like a tire going flat and then comes for you, is not being aggressive. Be sure to stand your ground. I'm sure it is just trying to escape from you and is confused about the fact that one does not usually escape from something by going directly toward it.
You asked who had been bitten and have been told of three people who have.
This thread reminds me of the idiot who was going to live with the Brown bear in Alaska, worked for awhile, before I think he and his girlfriend were partially eaten, gee I wonder who was eaten first, and if whoever was second tried to console the bear?
From the Florida Museum of Natural History website ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Line Squirrel
Habitat: Any wetlands or waterway in the state. Cottonmouths can be found along streams, springs, rivers, lakes, ponds, marshes, swamps, sloughs, reservoirs, retention pools, canals, and roadside ditches. It occasionally wanders far from water, and has been found in bushes and trees.
Let the debate continue ... lol
I want to clarify myself on tree climbing, I'm not talking about Tarzan skinning up to the tops of trees and swinging from one to another on vines kind of tree climbing, I'm talking about getting high enough out of the water to fall into a canoe type of climbing.
Also from the site you quote and the link i listed above:Quote:
Originally Posted by lowvoltguy1972
"When threatened, the cottonmouth may respond by coiling its body and opening its mouth as though ready to bite. The exposed white interior of the mouth is what gave rise to the common name, 'cottonmouth.' If not hard pressed, the cottonmouth usually will retreat. This open mouth threat display has led to the widespread belief that cottonmouths are aggressive snakes. In fact, as a rule they are one of the more sedate, even placid, venomous snakes.
Some people believe cottonmouths lie in wait on tree limbs overhanging water so they can drop into boats. These are usually cases of mistaken identity. The harmless brown watersnake often basks on tree limbs over the water, and when frightened by a rapidly approaching boat, they will escape by throwing themselves off the limb and into the water. Occasionally the watersnake's attempt to flee comes too late and it falls not into the water, but into the boat."
Hard pressed as mentioned above in the quote might include being repeatedly struck by an oar.
You think? :) I was all of maybe 12 at the time, probably younger. I still have the canoe, and it still has the dents. Hardest part was it was late in the afternoon and as I didn't have an operable paddle anymore I had to stick my hands in the water to paddle back or spend part of the night in the swamp.Quote:
Originally Posted by wingman
Can someone offer any scientific proof of their aggressive nature? The answer is NO. Saying they are aggressive is the same ignorance that sharks are killers.
When I was 19 I was fishing at an old pond out in a heavily wooded and remote area in Louisiana. Stepped a little to close to the water and a moccasin latched on to the back of my right calf. I spun around a couple of times and was able to get it off of me pretty quick, but it was still able to deposit a good dose of venom in my leg.
The venom felt like someone had injected me with liquid fire. Burned like hell. As soon as it dropped off my leg it tried to slither away but I guess without thinking about it I was able to stomp on the snakes head and kill it. And although I was right on the verge of freaking out I had enough sense to take the snake with me so it could be identified.
Had to walk about half a mile, then drive for about thirty minutes to the hospital. I stopped a couple of time and forced myself to relax as my heart rate was trying to make my chest explode. My leg started swelling around the bite area and spread down to my ankle, then just as I got to the hospital the swelling started up to my knee.
This was about 1982 and as I was a military dependent went to the Army hospital at Ft. Polk. The doctors were all American and Ft. Polk has a large training area with a lot of swampy area and troops routinely come in contact with venomous snakes, so the hospital staff knew what to do. I was taken into the trauma area, and when I showed them the snake that bit me they knew what anti venom to use. Was put on a drip and told to relax; yeah, fat chance of that.
By now I was getting a pretty good headache, and for the next 12 hours or so I was floating around like I had drank a bottle of really bad tequila. The next day things got better, and the swelling and pain in the leg started to diminish. The doctors said that because of the fact that I was a rather large individual my body's natural immune system plus the anti venom combined was able to contract the effects of the poison so I was only in the hospital for one night.
I was kind of dizzy for a couple of days, and it took a couple of weeks before I could walk without pain in my lower right leg, and I still have a scar where some of the flesh rotted away, but all is good.
According to the docs, I now have enough antibodies in my system to fight off the effects of another bite, I still get a scare if I see on of those slimy critters close by me.
C'mon Kevin can you "prove" they aren't ? Of course not, and I sort of think sharks do kill, I don't think they are primarily scavengers. I know what you meant, I turned it around on you, as is common here.
It doesn't matter one little bit to me if most of them are peace loving, a few aren't, and I don't know how to distinguish between the ones that are, and the ones that aren't.
Gee, I guess I'm guilty of "profiling" aren't I?
So long as they let me be, I let them be. I don't know the last time I killed one, but then I don't go back into the swamp like I used to either, there isn't nearly as much swamp as there used to be.
I say it because I had to work with a herpetologist for 5 months. I HATED it and the snakes. He got me bitten more than once by different snakes and then proved that the fearsome water moccasin had a bad rap. Will they bite? Of course. Why? Fear. I had one bite my boot, I think since I was in it the bite was deserved. I knew it couldn't penetrate it but I still learned from it. Read some facts from accredited sources on them. They are pretty cool animals actually. Do I care to play with them? No way!!!!
Although I've been chased by a couple of moccasin's, I too believe it was a case of them being protective. And I've never been bitten.
But those damn sturgeon's in the Suwannee, now those eff'ers will kill you.
Protective = AggressiveQuote:
Originally Posted by kensuf
If a snake's coming after me I don't really care much about its motivation. We're not going to sit there and talk it out.
I have had the opportunity to be around copper heads, timber rattlers, and cotton mouths.
In my opinion by far the most aggressive snake out there is the brown water snake and on occasion a blue or black racer non-poison of coarse.
I have never been afraid of snakes and had a good respect after being bitten as a kid by a brown water snake.
I am not certain if either of us knew the other was there but we both wanted the frog.
I grabbed for the frog and he did to only what he got was me.
Not a funny story as the end result was a visit to the ER and unhappy parents who exterminated all snakes for years to come.
A very bad deal for the snakes, I harbor no ill will and have one that lives in my pond even now a real dandy about 48' to 50' inches long.
Most snake bites are a result of direct threat or pressure, stepping on or very close to a coiled snake.
The rattlers and copper heads will coil but prefer to avoid contact with animals bigger than their dinner.
I have seen the cotton mouths, brown water snakes, copper heads in bushes, low limbs as others have said they are trying to get away most of the time they fall in water craft.
I have had them swim out to the boat and or canoe to investigate or challenge an invader into their territory.
The only snake that has ever sought non-prey I have ever seen was a breed of garter snake at a property I used to own.
They had red stripes on them and a bad attitude to boot.
The only snake that would crawl up to you and then coil and strike you repeatedly.
It was actually quite humorous as they would put their heads above the grass and chase the mower, people, dogs it did not matter.
By far the fiercest threat defense I have ever seen.
I allow many snakes around my home but my wife and kids are aware of them and not bothered by there occupancy.
The neighbors are not so keen on them but that is another good reason for keep them around.
One shot that Wes has of the large cotton mouth is beautiful.
What can I say, live and let live till one of us gets hungry!
JCG
I have had two close encounters with moccassins while running on the trails. Fortunately for me, each time the snake did not act aggressively at all. In the first encounter I was running along and didn't see the snake lying across the trail until I stepped over it. It could have very easily bitten me but didn't. The second time was an even closer call and nearly gave me heart failure. This time my foot landed within inches of the snake's head and still the snake did not bite me. Maybe it has something to do with the seasons. My encounters were in late summer/early fall.
I think you mean ellipsis. An ellipse is a geometric figure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Grammar coppin the grammar cop, kinda funny
Running trotlines in Louisianna, I had a moccasin attempt to get into my boat but a woman on the bank informed me of the situation and I slapped the waterwith the paddle and he hightailed it outta there. I saw the head good and it was pretty wide. Have had many encounters with banded watersnakes as well but never bitten. 2 years ago we were kayaking the Suwannee from Telford to Convict and the kid that was with us turned to go into convicts run when he hit a tree on its edge. He then started screaming and jumped out hollarin snake in the boat. We pulled it on the bank and shook it out, it fell on his lap and slithered behind him in the enclosed kayak. It was the meanest most aggresive watersnake Ive ever seen and it got smashed right ther on the bank. It would try to strike us and sling saliva 5 ft and it was big too. The owner saw the commotion from the elevated diner and wasent too happy about him killing it. It had a flared head as well and I couldnt be sure till it was dead that it was non poisonous. The owner called it an oak? My buddy got bit on the flipflop in his backyard by a pigmy rattler one night and it got stuck hangin off it he thought it was some tape or something and went to pullit off and bout crapped his shorts.
Attachment 6529
Shhhhhpp. Shhhhhhp.
If you are having problems with a misbehaving snake I can help.
Shhhhhp. Shhhhhhpp.
I will whisper the the offensive viper and soon we will be freinds.
Shhhhp. Shhhhhhp.
Calm Down!!!!
Pretty ball python. My little girl has a pet b.p. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by hunabku
Grammar coppin' the Droid auto-correct!Quote:
Originally Posted by SuPrBuGmAn
'scuses
Bottom line most encounters with a water snake or snake by the water or what have you are the Banded or Black Water snake. Want to see a bunch of them go to Bruford on a sunny day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stairman
Man oh man the memories. Not a single person has known what a trotline is since I moved out of Louisiana. We grew up trotlining gar and smacking em in the head with a paddle to get them in the pirogue. If I even bring it up to anyone in Florida they ask if I'm cajun or if I know anybody from that swamp show.
Again I think this is all based on where you live. Come back home with me and see if the numbers are the same. The Manchac swamp is rittled with moccassins compared to any other snake.Quote:
Originally Posted by curtschu
Back in the early 80's our sub was one of the first in King's Bay GA. We had a bad habit of cooling the reactor with a fire hose in port when shut down. One would have to climb on the pressure hull inside the outer skin to adjust the ball valve. The outer hull is a free flood area covered in very black paint .. and other stuff. Nice and toasty on an otherwise cool day in Georgia. We learned pretty quickly to bang the crap out of the hull with a very large metallic object prior to going in there. They were not always cotton mouths, but enough were.
But no, never bitten and never knew anyone who was til I read this thread.
I went to high school in southern AR and regularly ran trotlines for mud cat and yo yos for channel cat on the Ouachita River and its wetlands. Great fun and good eating.Quote:
Originally Posted by rddvet
You're kidding, right? Don't you realize this is the Internet?Quote:
Originally Posted by Line Squirrel
Hi:
I was bitten by a copperhead as a child and had an encounter with a WM at Madison....still have scars on my knee from the copperhead.....the WM is a distant cousin of the copperhead, WM's venom is more toxic then the copperhead and is a hemotoxin, that's why swelling and tissue damage is the norm. WM bites are early fatal but do require immediate medical attention, if a bit goes ignored the odds of loosing a limb grow ten fold.
Young WM can easily be mistaken for Water Snakes, the best way to tell is the eyes, if the eyes are slits like a cat then you know it's a pit viper..so stay away.
WM's aren't really aggressive towards humans but during mating season (mid may thru mid June) they should be avoided because they become very unpredictable during this time, what makes people think they are aggressive is because they are in fact "lazy snakes" that means they don't move out of the way as quickly as the hundreds of other snakes that avoid human contact at any cost, so when we come across one we react and so does the snake.
WM's are most comfortable on river banks and swamps near warm water 80 degrees or so and generally avoid the cooler springs that are 72 degrees but they do like intersections where warn water meets cool spring water. They are incredibly adaptive and have been found in forests hundreds of miles from warm water.
If WM's went after people I think many divers would have been bit, but as with all snakes it's better to shoot first and ask questions later.
The WM at Telford has been handled.
When I lived in Thibodaux LA, I never ran a trot-line, but we went frog gigging quite a bit. It was very common to see snakes in tree branches that hung down into the water. We were always very careful when approaching a frog that was under tree limbs for this reason. If a snake had fallen in the boat, we were likely to knock the beer cooler into the bayou trying to get it out and that would have been a major disaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by rddvet
These trips ended when we got busted by the Game and Fish for having guns in the boat. None of us knew it was illegal. It cost us $75 each to pay the fine. We quit frog gigging because I was not going out into that swamp in the middle of the night without weapons! Yeah, there were lots of gators out there, but that's not who we were worried about.
Growing up on a farm in middle GA, we set trot-lines in ponds, lakes and rivers all the time. It got real interesting when you caught a 50 lb snapping turtle.
This thread will be revived 4 or 5 years from now when some new cave diver fines it and has a comment to make about getting chased.Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Greenberg
I used to do a lot of frog gigging and have run a trot line or two for catfish, when frog gigging, it was common to shine your light behind the canoe and see a couple of snakes in the wake, I have no idea why they would follow us, perhaps because we were scaring many frogs into the water?
Same thing happens with sharks. Every time someone sees a shark that isn't a hammerhead, it's automatically a bull shark. I've probably seen over a hundred sharks, and maybe five were bulls.Quote:
Originally Posted by Line Squirrel