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My name is Ruben, i am an Industrial Design student at Massey Univeristy, New Zealand.
I was wondering if someone was able to advise me on some design opportunities within the activities of Cave Diving.
Are there any major safety issues, difficulties with equipment, or any topics broad or narrow which needs improvement?
this would be of much help.
Cheers
Ruben
I would suggest to come up with special edition urination catheters. Each individual pack should contain a little Chinese cookie tip with one of the 5th rules of safe cave diving plus a quote of the day from OFG.
Come on Ary, the poor guy is new, and not a cave diver. He has no clue what you mean :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by ARY
Ruben,
There are plenty of design problems to solve in the area of technical diving, but most of them are engineering challenges. For the most part, divers don't care what it looks like only that it works 99.999999% of the time. Look at lights, tanks, DPV's and rebreathers, to name a few. There is plenty of room for improvement in the areas of lighter, faster, cheaper and more reliable.
I had no idea you were hillarious :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ARY
My suggestion is to design products for something you are more familiar with... Just a thought.
bingo!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tegg
You know, the person that designed the Scubapro Pilot (which evolved into the D-400) did it for a college class and wasn't a diver. It's possibly the easiest-breathing regulator ever.
Room for improvement??? say it ain't so ???Quote:
Originally Posted by gasdiver
If he designs new stuff to make my investment obsolete... I'll cry...
As long as its nothing I'm breathing from, I'll be your test pilot....
Cave diving innovation seems to come from evolution or devolution of gear by those who are trying to solve problems they experience while diving. There is still a lot of room for development of lights and dpv's (scooters) with regard to materials, design, battery technology,.LED.arrays, reflectors. I suggest talking with your fellow Kiwi Cavers in person for ideas.
Here is one. Design a 5lbs cart that can carry 300+ lbs of gear.with 2-4 spots.for.tanks.of.all.sizes, has wheels.that never go.flat, can be locked to a tree with 2 meters of retractable steel cable, can hop logs without needing help, won't rust, fits in a trunk.folding.down, can survive abuse of heavy steel tanks on rutted.trails, can stand up to swamps, salt, fresh water and.mud, is.perfectly laid.out.for.all.our.gear which could include saws and machetes and an occasional chainsaw,looks.ultra.bitchen, but more important functions as perfectly and reliably as our gear, and.sells for.less.than a. hardware store dolly, wheelbarrow, or wagon.
I have one, his name is Paul Carlson... A.K.A. Tanzig
ok thanks for the replies guys.
i am doing this as part of a paper on a topic i know nothing about.
This could ultimately result in a possible design solution at your benefit.
Any ideas are welcome.
Im not necessarily just looking at aesthetics. Both functionality and user-interaction are important in any product design.
cheers
Well at least we know what Paul Carlson... A.K.A. Tanzig looks like :)Quote:
Originally Posted by DogHouseDiver
Yes...but it was extremely complex for a regulator, had parts that had to be machined to very precise tolerances and proved to be exceptionally difficult to maintain in service. So while it was (and remains perhpas the best second stage ever made, it was only produced for a few years, was not an economic success and was discontinued as it was very difficult to support in the field, and most of those that remained in service were converted to use the center balanced internals in the much simpler to produce and service "Air 1".Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Consequently, if the college student who had designed it had a greater knowledge of the diving requirements and the realities of the LDS based regular service model, he'd have made far better choices in terms of priorities and design requirements, and designed something like the Air 1, which gave 95% of the Pilot's performance in an easier to produce and service package - one in which the basic internal design elements persisted for over 20 years in later D300, D350 and D400 design evolutions of the center balanced valve design.
Which is to say, a person knowing nothng about regulator or cave diving equipment design can add badly needed fresh perspective, but they would be well advised to be very thorough in researching as many apsects as possible of the universe in which that design must function.
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by RubenN
I have the inate ability to foul any reel.... anywhere.... heck I can foul finger spools. It's a gift. Because of same I have 5 primary reels and am still searching.......
There is a challenge for ya......
I don't dive rebreathers, but one thing I have noticed is a vast majority of them do not have a means for monitoring CO2 levels in the breathing loop. When you look certain medical ventilators (mainly anesthesia machines), you'll notice they are actually rebreathers. For some time now, CO2 monitoring has been used in anesthesia and has even started to be used in prehospital medicine. The "End Tidal CO2" systems used in the prehospital setting are actually fairly rugged. I know that if I ever started diving a rebreather, I would want to be able to monitor my CO2 levels. People who already rebreathers might say that it is unnecessary, but I can tell you from experience how much a end tidal CO2 level can tell you about metabolic status and many other things.
We need to dive! I was the "foul reel fouler" for the longest, but I have one now that I haven't been able to foul, despite my best efforts. I've even handed it off to others. No one has fouled it yet! Your opportunity to be the first awaits! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJersey
Ruben,Quote:
Originally Posted by floridakid
That would be a project that would not only pass you in that class, but make you millions.
True, I know I won't be getting a rebreather until this is developed.Quote:
Originally Posted by FW
nevermind
You are on!Quote:
Originally Posted by sskasser
It isnt one of these is it?
http://www.cavediver.net/forum/galle.../7/8/reels.jpg
I heard that the Sentinel has an optional CO2 sensor but I don't know how it is set up. The ultimate would be a CO2 waveform (Waveform Capnography) displayed on the HUD, but that actually might be a little overkill. The advantage of the waveform is not only would you be able to asses how well the scrubber is removing CO2 from the breathing loop, but you could get real time feedback on the metabolic status of the diver. Unfortunately, with the way most rebreathers are set up, true end tidal (the very last of the gas from an exhalation) would not really be possible in the traditional sense. But a CO2 sensor located in between the counterlungs and the mouthpiece would at least ensure that the gas in the breathing loop is not hypercapnic.
I know the diver out there are more than likely aware of this fact, but I don't know how much you know about physiology...In a normal person, the urge to breath is not really stimulated by lack of oxygen but by a rise of CO2 levels in arterial blood. Essentially, if you breath gas that has a high level of CO2 (and a high level of CO2 is really not that much), the CO2 gradient (the level of CO2 in the blood versus the level in gas) in the lungs is changed and CO2 cannot as easily be eliminated. The body senses this rise in arterial CO2 levels and interprets it as a need to increase the respiratory rate. This can occur even with perfect arterial O2 levels. If the problem is not fixed fairly quickly, the person breathing the hypercapnic gas will at first increase their respiratory rate, then they will panic as they begin to feel the sensation of being out of breath. Eventually, as the CO2 level rises, the diver would panic, and the body would actually begin to produce even more CO2 and would further exacerbate the problem. Eventually, as CO2 levels rise in the blood, The very high CO2 actually causes sedation (not the good kind) and unconsciousness. The blood PH drops (because CO2 dissolved in blood is acidic) and the person dies.
Nope, none of those. :D You'd be hard pressed to find one like mine at any shop.Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJersey
OH, that one, with the pink line :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by sskasser
Then we need to dive!!Quote:
Originally Posted by sskasser
Yep! That's the one! It was gorgeous without any line at all, but with the pink line....just WOW!!! ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by FW
Indeed! Let's!Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJersey
It's not you (or at least all you), it's the reels....Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJersey
Thanks 'floridakid' that is very helpful for me.
Are you able to tell me a little about the specifics of a dive.
in terms of speleology:
-Do you take samples of the area/environment.
-do you take photos.
-how do you study the caves.
-what sort of additional equipment is used.
or if your not cave diving for research purposes, what is done when your in the cave?
much help
cheers
I can't tell you much speleology, because I am just now getting into cave diving. In fact I don't even dive a rebreather. Most of my knowledge and experience relates to my profession as a paramedic that assists our medical director in writing medical protocols for a very rual EMS system with very long transport times. A few months ago, as a side project, I worked on a design for a safer Nitrous Oxide administration system for EMS that was not as prone to diversion (ems personnel huffing the gas between calls) and the design I came up with was pretty much a semi-closed rebreather. Unfortunately, it was not cost effective, too big, too complicated, and was pretty much an anesthesia machine (minus the volatile liquid anesthetics) mounted in an ambulance. It would have created more problems than it would have solved. Plus the average paramedic would need too much training to use the machine than what it was worth. But I learned a little about rebreathers in the process so it was not all a loss, lol.
Co2 monitoring already exists, and is not really that expensive. But it is not really needed. A properly maintained and packed unit should never be a problem. Your body will also tell you if you have a problem. Now if you could invent a solution for if that problem happened????
Let's see a photo of that reel?
What we need is a weight that doesn't weight much in air passages.
I don't know where you got that info, but many a rebreather diver is waiting to buy such a cheap and effective device. Oh wait was "effective" the key word there? In the rebreather's loop environment, there are problems with the simple and cheap sensors. By the time that your body tells you that something is wrong and there is a CO2 problem, it very well may be too late to be able to do anything about it. I am fortunate enough to have survived just such an issue, but do not know if I could do it again or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by deepairmike
The solution to to make sure that it doesn't happen in the first place. Thus CO2 monitoring!!!
Here's something that might be of some value: a cylinder that weighs the same full as empty.
It could have a section that is much less rigid than the actual cylinder wall - it expands when the cylinder is full, and gradually contracts as the cylinder is breathed. As an example, an 80 cubic foot cylinder could expand to approximately six more pounds of buoyancy when the cylinder is full.
If you got your buoyancy right you wouldn't need a BC.
And what caused this event?
Working too hard and overbreathed the scrubber.Quote:
Originally Posted by deepairmike
If you mean Shirley's, check page 8 in "Blueprint for Survival". I suspect you have seen one before, in my van :-DQuote:
Originally Posted by deepairmike
I did the same thing, see the IRAP, "Strange Symptoms". It is one of the early ones.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsix36
Attachment 4904Quote:
Originally Posted by deepairmike
It's the one with the pretty pink line. It was and still is one of my most valued treasures, built and given to me by a wonderful friend....one with a long white beard ...but not this guy----> :smt114
The device you described exists. It's called a..... BCQuote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Sihrley, I have an enclosed reel. I foul it. Had this discussion with Forrest and unless he has a secret (and will build me one) that isnt in my reel... I can foul it......
I have just started to watch James Cameron's "Sanctum", got a couple of questions about that.
is that robot camera thing that follows the divers round, is that a real thing, do people use them.
Is there anything about the decompression chambers that is problematic or needs improving? i understand a fair bit of time can be needed in there sometimes.
cheers
ROVs are real... but they are a real PITA in caves, anything with a tether is gonna suck. I promise.
I watched that movie singing "Another one bites the dust.." the whole way through.