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I am looking for comments or questions about cavern diving under the ice. I live near Lake Superior. During the winter months the ice forms over the lake. There is a bay in Ashland Wisconsin that has a power plant. The warm water discharge into the lake keeps the water warm enough so it never freezes. Its an overhead environment with a fixed open water entrance and exit. My idea is to use this location for cavern training as we don't have caves in northern Minnesota. Any comments?
Other than move to Florida? :clapper
Florida already has too many people. Move to Georgia and drive down to Florida to dive on the weekends.
Doesn't sound like a great idea, frankly. I doubt the location has conditions similar to what students would experience in a real cavern: silt, rock formations, flow, etc., etc. They might become trained for ice diving, but ice diving <> cave diving.Quote:
My idea is to use this location for cavern training ...
Better check with the agency that you plan to teach through. Let them decide.
SLIM
Most agencies also require at least 2 sites be used for the cavern course. Another issue is that the site is not technically a cavern by definition since it's not part of a cave. Would training at this site truly prepare students for cavern diving in Florida or Mexico?
Besides, wouldn't that icy water make the obligatory alligators a bit lethargic? (NSS-CDS did add the gator wrestling drill to the cavern course, didn't they?)
Seriously, I really think to do a cavern cert, your students will need to be in an actual cavern. There's more to caverns and caves than the ceiling.
Thanks a lot for the input. I like the first one the best. Think I'll move to Florida. I'm tired of freezing my but.
I have done ice dives using cave/cavern techniques from open water. This has usually been in circumstances where the main portion of a lake is open while a bay is still ice covered allowing you to enter the water from land on a point, and then swim back under the ice shelf from open water.
Cavern techniques are used, but it is nothing like cavern diving for several reaosns:
1. It's never dark and there is really no reliance on agood t light.
2, The topography is usually very lake like rather than cavern like.
3. The ceiling is flat and translucent.
4. line skills are less important and it's hard to find tie offs and placements that replicate what you'd se in a cavern. That has obvious training implications.
5. It's really frickin cold and that also has an impact on the line skills you can use/teach.
Also in addition to having a very hard time selling the pseudo cavern training to a cave training agency, if the agency also teaches ice diving, you will pose a liability iss ue to them as well as you are in effect ice diving but not using (traditional) approved ice diving techniques.
Your best bet may be to develop a course reflectig what it really is - ice diving using a subset of cavern diving techniques.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diverpaul69
Be aware that we've recently added an immigration tax for snowbirds wanting to move down here. Send me your credit card number and I'll get the paperwork started for you. :yawinkle:
I saw this on Facebook recently:
Florida - God's Waiting Room
Well, what else are you supposed to do with yankees besides bury them? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Some are waiting for Satan instead of God though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Hmmm, perhaps cash our checks?Quote:
Originally Posted by Half-Fast
The wife and I are planning to head there some day. If the kids weren't settled in here, we'd do it.
Couldn't you just mail the checks?Quote:
Originally Posted by ScubaGypsy
You would do well to first go to your local library & read up on early American history for this area ! :) There are a lot of things in this part of our country that are hidden from most people. I spent 8 months up there one year working & diving almost every day. The lake will freeze over quickly in calm weather, & is ultra clear for diving. The rock & cavern formations around the Apostle Islands are beautiful, & there are many caverns to poke around in. You will find whole houses & near perfect model Ts in deeper waters that have gone thru spring ice while being driven across the lake to Madeline Island. These storys are fun to read about. Far as cavern & cave training goes, you would be best to head for Florida for the proper training needed.
Have fun
je
je,
Did you get any photo's of those old cars at the bottom of the lake? Those would be cool to look at!
I wonder how many lift bags it would take to break one free...
Don't I also recall a song ... "The Devil came came down to Georgia"Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
So let me think, God's waiting room and cave diving , or dueling with the Devil ....
Quote:
Originally Posted by diveconjeff
Notice that the Devil went down to Georgia. Obviously he lives in the north... :)
I have adapter cave diving techniques to ice diving, It worked well but it is only adaptations and not really cave or ice diving. I would recommend teaching ice diving up north and running a trip to Missouri or Florida to teach cavern.
**Sorry,Quote:
Originally Posted by gasdiver
I did not have a housing for my camera at that time. We can presume that these cars are still where they were some years ago. Amongst other things you will find early pioneer & fur trading items. The Red Cliff {Chipawa tribe}residents are skilled open water divers & are a good source of information as well. I made fast friends with them. Do not intimadate or make fun of them. They will be happy to share information with you if you are respectful with them.
Look anywhere from shallow water 10' to 70'. That is where I mostly found things at. The bigger wrecks are in open water & much deeper, up towards Isle Royale Nat'l Park. I liked diving around the Apostles because they are easily accesable. I do not publish locations of finds, but if you pm me I will be happy to tell you where to look. ^)^ je
No, I'm pretty sure he lives in Tennessee. And while Tennessee was the last southern state to cecede and are kinda in the middle, they are still "south".Quote:
Originally Posted by Half-Fast
You sure it's not Kentucky? After all, KY never did secede.Quote:
Originally Posted by DA Aquamaster