Survey on psychological aspects of "extreme" diving

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05-29-2009 03:36 PM
College Diver

Survey on psychological aspects of "extreme" diving

I'm posting this for a fellow student:

> Hi,
>
> I'm a
> Masters student at Bangor University doing a dissertation about
> psychology and
> scuba diving. For this dissertation I need male scuba
> divers who do
> extreme/risky/challenging dives to fill out an online
> questionnaire. Unfortunately there are not many divers
> fitting this description, so i was hoping that you could help a
> fellow diver to
> find some participants for her study.
>
> In the
> questionnaire the divers will be asked about their emotions and feelings when
> doing a "risky" scuba dive, as well as in daily life.
> Participants are free
> to drop out of the study at any given time. It would be greatly
> appreciated if you
> could send the link to my study to some
> recreational divers you might know,
> or maybe even to the club members. I really hope you can help me since
> adventurous scuba divers are very difficult to find.
> http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...w3T8_2bg_3d_3d
>
> Thank
> you for your time and have a nice dive!
> Cheers,
> Fleur van
> Rens
05-29-2009 03:59 PM
amphipod06

Why males only?

Dive safe,

Celia
05-29-2009 04:06 PM
sea2summit

Quote:

Originally Posted by College Diver

For this dissertation I need male scuba divers who do extreme/risky/challenging dives to fill out an online questionnaire. Unfortunately there are not many divers fitting this description,

I wonder why? Someone should do a study on that.

Seriously though I've done "extreme" dives by diving when the water was so cold the top 3" was ice slush:smt102. I've done "risky" dives every time I put the reg/DSV in my mouth:smt100. I've done "challenging" dives because I could never bring myself to get a p-valve:smt086

Need a better definition of what you're looking for I'd say:arrowgreen
05-29-2009 04:10 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

Why males only?

Dive safe,

Celia

I clicked the link and the front, registration page didn't say you have to be male. I 'spose I could pretend to be a man and take the survey.
05-29-2009 04:14 PM
Sludge

Why not, I pretend to be a man every day. :smt102
05-29-2009 04:21 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slüdge

Why not, I pretend to be a man every day. :smt102

You are a slug! I crush you beneath my feet! :smt079

:rollguy Just kidding! You started it!!!!!! :yawinkle:
05-29-2009 04:53 PM
sskasser

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

You are a slug! I crush you beneath my feet! :smt079

Don't do that! He LIKES that!
05-29-2009 04:59 PM
Kelly Jessop

Quote:

Originally Posted by sea2summit

I wonder why? Someone should do a study on that.

Seriously though I've done "extreme" dives by diving when the water was so cold the top 3" was ice slush:smt102. I've done "risky" dives every time I put the reg/DSV in my mouth:smt100. I've done "challenging" dives because I could never bring myself to get a p-valve:smt086

Need a better definition of what you're looking for I'd say:arrowgreen

I always felt the drive on I-75 was risky and extreme.
05-29-2009 05:11 PM
Squirrel Girl

Ya'll should have come to the Workshop and listened to Bill O's talk. My take away (corporate speak, see other thread), was that there is nothing to find. He said about all he could say was that cave divers were night people. So he took an audience vote. About 3:1 morning people.

:smt102
05-29-2009 06:20 PM
MengTze

I started it, but stopped. It seems to be geared towards 'thrill seeking' and finding a 'rush'. This to me seems already slanted and any answers will be geared towards those on-set premises. I disagree with that.

Nice effort though.
05-29-2009 06:49 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by MengTze

I started it, but stopped. It seems to be geared towards 'thrill seeking' and finding a 'rush'. This to me seems already slanted and any answers will be geared towards those on-set premises. I disagree with that.

Nice effort though.

I was explaining to someone today that there's not a huge "weeeeee" factor in cave diving. Bungee jumping would have a big weeeee factor (or in my case, I-eeeeeeeeee! http://www.deepcaves.net/smilies/eek.gif )
05-29-2009 06:49 PM
mfascuba

Extreme, Risky and Challenging are relative terms. The diving that I consider mundane some might consider extreme, but others might consider completely insignificant. I don't do risky dives, period. There may be inherent risk in the activity, but I manage it to a level that is acceptable to me. Challenging is also a relative word - I dive every week or two, and there are some dives that I find no challenge in that others who do different kinds of diving may find overwhelming. On the other hand, someone who dives every day in the same environment I dive in would likely not find my dives to be very challenging.

Mark
05-29-2009 07:42 PM
MengTze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

I was explaining to someone today that there's not a huge "weeeeee" factor in cave diving. Bungee jumping would have a big weeeee factor (or in my case, I-eeeeeeeeee! http://www.deepcaves.net/smilies/eek.gif )

I agree with you. You will not see me do a bungee or parachute/base jump.... THAT is extreme and seriously dangerous stuff. Once you engage.........you ARE committed.

I agree Mark, it is all relative. And the survey done from that viewpoint and base line of recreational diving makes cave diving extreme...
05-29-2009 08:04 PM
wingman

There's a psychologist named Zuckerman who has focused on sensation seeking and risky behavior (the title of his most recent book) and he developed scales for sensation seeking. One subscale is associated with thrill and adventure seeking...the desire to engage in physical activities that provide unusual sensations and experiences (he mentions mountain climbing and scuba). He suggests most of these activities are moderately risky and thus they deter lower sensation seekers from engaging in them. He also clearly states that it is the sensation reward for high sensation seekers, not the risk that attracts them. Sensation seeking has been linked to genetic and neural characteristics in a biobehavioral context and is also more heavily engaged in by males and young people (among other factors) for biological reasons and their data (read the 3 books and many papers) supports that. His definition is instructive:

"Sensation seeking is a trait defined by the seeking of of varied, novel, complex and intense sensations and experiences and the willingness to take physical, social, legal, and financial risks for the sake of such experience"

I interpret that from an economic perspective in terms of willingness to pay:) Zuckerman goes on to say "...sensation seekers do not seek risk for its own sake. It is not the riskiness of their activities that make them rewarding." He points out that many sensations are not risky at all (eg. a rock concert) and he also develops an explanation of why sensation seekers are willing to engage in risky behavior for the resulting stimulation.

All in all very interesting stuff and it would be intersting to get a sample of cave divers to fill out a sensation seeking scale. Just happen to be reading his latest book at the moment for a research project i am involved in in another context. Bill
05-29-2009 08:41 PM
MORGAN

Sudden midair urinary incontinence!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

I was explaining to someone today that there's not a huge "weeeeee" factor in cave diving. Bungee jumping would have a big weeeee factor (or in my case, I-eeeeeeeeee! http://www.deepcaves.net/smilies/eek.gif )

Or Peeeeeeee! I'm pretty sure I'd wet my pants (at least!) if I bungee jumped! I'm not scared of heights - used to be a firefighter, rock & ice climber, vertical caver, and think parachuting would be fun to try. But I have no desire to bungee jump - or more accurately a powerful desire not to! There's something about it that's just wrong!

Mike
05-29-2009 09:05 PM
J_glenn06

I just done understand why anyone would jump out of an airplane that is perfectly fine with landing!!:smt102
05-29-2009 09:27 PM
sskasser

Quote:

Originally Posted by J_glenn06

I just done understand why anyone would jump out of an airplane that is perfectly fine with landing!!:smt102

Because it TOTALLY ROCKS! Having more take-offs than landings in planes is Suh WEEEET!
05-29-2009 10:36 PM
wingman

Quote:

Originally Posted by sskasser

Because it TOTALLY ROCKS! Having more take-offs than landings in planes is Suh WEEEET!

I did not know you were a jumper...spent a lot of time doing that myself in my younger days (USPA class C)...was on a 10 man star team and lettered in collegiate sport parachuting; had the honor of closing the first five man over my university drop zone and was also on a demo team jumping into stadiums and such. I quit many years ago but many fond (and a few not so fond) memories. Always have had more landings than takeoffs and that's becuse i also spent a lot of time flying the jump planes and launching meat missiles...<lol>
05-29-2009 11:35 PM
aainslie

Quote:

Originally Posted by MengTze

I started it, but stopped. It seems to be geared towards 'thrill seeking' and finding a 'rush'. This to me seems already slanted and any answers will be geared towards those on-set premises. I disagree with that.

Nice effort though.

All the more reason why you should answer it.

This kid entirely misses the point of "thrill seeking" sports. He's buying onto the myth that it's about adrenalin, and missing that it's about control.
05-30-2009 06:10 AM
bletso

Quote:

Originally Posted by aainslie

This kid entirely misses the point of "thrill seeking" sports. He's buying onto the myth that it's about adrenalin, and missing that it's about control.

At least with me it is about about control. I like to stack the cards in my favor, and if I can't, I won't do the dive. It's not about a rush, I get that just by diving.

No one has ever talked me into a dive I wasn't comfortable about. Yes, many people think I am a loose wire. I dive caves and deep with my own MCCR unit. As stated, risk is relative to ones POV and experience.

Safe Diving

Dale
05-30-2009 10:33 AM
Gene_Hobbs

Lo thesis

You all might find this an interesting read...

Lo, RCY. 2006. Personal and Social Dimensions of Risky Diving Behaviour. Honours Thesis. University of Melbourne. RRR ID: 7594
05-31-2009 05:28 AM
cavedivingwoman

survey

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

Why males only?

Dive safe,

Celia

My feelings exactly. Unless, of course, your hypothesis contains a bias. What is it, BTW?
Barbara/San Francisco
05-31-2009 05:33 AM
cavedivingwoman

night people?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

Ya'll should have come to the Workshop and listened to Bill O's talk. My take away (corporate speak, see other thread), was that there is nothing to find. He said about all he could say was that cave divers were night people. So he took an audience vote. About 3:1 morning people.

:smt102

Barbara, I believe you (as I sit here at 3:30am PDT, jet lagged from my trip home. Hope you got home OK as well. When are we going boat stealing again?

BTW, there is a psychiatrist who studies diving and the effects of panic---David Colvard, MD. I think he is hooked up with DAN. If you ever see him on a dive boat, he has the goofiest fins I've ever seen (the blades flip up so he can walk in them). Anyway, the poster here should check out David's pubs and also look at the Undersea Hyperbaric Medical Society's archives to see if this work has been done and if so, what can be added.

Cheers,
Barbara/San Francisco
05-31-2009 05:42 AM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavedivingwoman

Barbara, I believe you (as I sit here at 3:30am PDT, jet lagged from my trip home. Hope you got home OK as well. When are we going boat stealing again?

BTW, there is a psychiatrist who studies diving and the effects of panic---David Colvard, MD. I think he is hooked up with DAN. If you ever see him on a dive boat, he has the goofiest fins I've ever seen (the blades flip up so he can walk in them). Anyway, the poster here should check out David's pubs and also look at the Undersea Hyperbaric Medical Society's archives to see if this work has been done and if so, what can be added.

Cheers,
Barbara/San Francisco

Hi Barbara, I had NOTHING to do with boat stealing! It's not my fault your boat was stolen, and I just happened to be riding it.

I figure Bill O has as much handle on the concepts as anyone. And even his presentation didn't come to any conclusion that made much sense to me.

When we went to Huautla, the U of TX, Galveston tried to do a study of us as proxies for who would go into space. The only thing that seemed to make any sense was their study of sleep. We had to keep sleep logs. Only Ian and I were very diligent at it. A few years after our expedition, they published a paper. It seemed extremely contrived--they didn't have enough data that made sense, so they made an interpretation that they thought worked. But it didn't seem right to us.
05-31-2009 05:45 AM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

Hi Barbara, I had NOTHING to do with boat stealing! It's not my fault your boat was stolen, and I just happened to be riding it.

I figure Bill O has as much handle on the concepts as anyone. And even his presentation didn't come to any conclusion that made much sense to me.

When we went to Huautla, the U of TX, Galveston tried to do a study of us as proxies for who would go into space. The only thing that seemed to make any sense was their study of sleep. We had to keep sleep logs. Only Ian and I were very diligent at it. A few years after our expedition, they published a paper. It seemed extremely contrived--they didn't have enough data that made sense, so they made an interpretation that they thought worked. But it didn't seem right to us.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavedivingwoman

My feelings exactly. Unless, of course, your hypothesis contains a bias. What is it, BTW?
Barbara/San Francisco

Actually, as I think about it, he might assume (perhaps rightly) that there aren't very many women in cave diving, and that the statistics wouldn't be meaningful without a higher population to sample from. Certainly there are differences between men and women, so he might want to keep them separate.
05-31-2009 08:23 AM
MengTze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

Actually, as I think about it, he might assume (perhaps rightly) that there aren't very many women in cave diving, and that the statistics wouldn't be meaningful without a higher population to sample from. Certainly there are differences between men and women, so he might want to keep them separate.

No, the reason for that is probably that when men cave dive, they are macho and cool. When women cave dive, they are crazy and irrational. We all know you can not get solid answers from crazy and irrational people...:roll:
05-31-2009 11:16 AM
amphipod06

Quote:

Originally Posted by MengTze

No, the reason for that is probably that when men cave dive, they are macho and cool. When women cave dive, they are crazy and irrational. We all know you can not get solid answers from crazy and irrational people...:roll:

Really? So how come it's the males that end up in the obituary section?

Just kidding (maybe not...).

Dive safe,

Celia
05-31-2009 04:26 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by MengTze

No, the reason for that is probably that when men cave dive, they are macho and cool. When women cave dive, they are crazy and irrational. We all know you can not get solid answers from crazy and irrational people...:roll:

I resemble that remark! :smt079
05-31-2009 06:34 PM
sskasser

Quote:

Originally Posted by MengTze

No, the reason for that is probably that when men cave dive, they are macho and cool. When women cave dive, they are crazy and irrational. We all know you can not get solid answers from crazy and irrational people...:roll:

:rollguy:rollguy:rollguy
06-01-2009 06:44 AM
OFG-1

Quote:

Originally Posted by amphipod06

Why males only?

Dive safe,

Celia

I asked about this, and found ot that the surveymonkey web site has a built in cootie filter, and girls (who are known carriers of cooties) cant get past the filter.

BTW, why would anyone spend their time on a site called surveymonkey. Monkey's cant survey hell, they cant even level the transit.
06-01-2009 07:05 AM
MORGAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by OFG-1

I asked about this, and found ot that the surveymonkey web site has a built in cootie filter, and girls (who are known carriers of cooties) cant get past the filter.

BTW, why would anyone spend their time on a site called surveymonkey. Monkey's cant survey hell, they cant even level the transit.

LOL! I hope the cootie filter works both ways, to keep the monkeys from spreading their nasty monkey cooties and flinging their feces at people.

I occasionally serve as a survey monkey for a friend who's a surveyor. My part of the job is lugging gear up mountainsides and through swamps, standing in mud or pricker bushes ignoring the mosquitos and black flies, holding the prism very still, and running the dumb end of the tape. His part of the job is peering through the transit muttering distractedly to himself, telling me where to go and where to hold the prism, and correcting me when I call his machine a transit. ("It's a theodolite!") He calls the friends that he talks into doing this "survey monkeys", as in, "I've got a job on Spruce Mountain; you want to monkey for me tomorrow? I have noticed that on the bill we are referred to as "Field Survey Technicians". So, you don't have to be able to survey (or even level the transit, er, theodolite) to be a survey monkey.

Maybe my next career will be tank monkey!

Mike
06-01-2009 07:11 AM
sskasser

:flea

Quote:

Originally Posted by OFG-1

I asked about this, and found ot that the surveymonkey web site has a built in cootie filter, and girls (who are known carriers of cooties) cant get past the filter.

BTW, why would anyone spend their time on a site called surveymonkey. Monkey's cant survey hell, they cant even level the transit.

Hehehe...no such cootie filter on CDF! Muwah! Muwah! Muwah! Now you have girl cooties all over your screen! :smt110 :smt044
06-01-2009 08:48 AM
OFG-1

Quote:

Originally Posted by sskasser

:flea

Hehehe...no such cootie filter on CDF! Muwah! Muwah! Muwah! Now you have girl cooties all over your screen! :smt110 :smt044

Yeech, I guess I now have to get my cyber screen cleaner working!

http://doglickingscreen.com/
06-01-2009 09:10 AM
FW

If nothing else, College Diver and his friend will have an interesting insight into the minds of cavedivers after reading this thread.
06-01-2009 11:05 AM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by OFG-1

I asked about this, and found ot that the surveymonkey web site has a built in cootie filter, and girls (who are known carriers of cooties) cant get past the filter.

Last Friday I had lunch with my usual group. One guy won't have lunch with me, if it's just the two of us and I tease him MERCILESSLY over that. MERCILESSLY. So bad that he actually will have lunch with me now.

So on Friday, we sat down at the booth and I made room on my side for the other guy. He mentioned cooties, but sat down anyway. I immediately sprinkled cooties all over him, quite liberally! Cooties, cooties, cooties!
06-01-2009 12:21 PM
sskasser

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

Last Friday I had lunch with my usual group. One guy won't have lunch with me, if it's just the two of us and I tease him MERCILESSLY over that. MERCILESSLY. So bad that he actually will have lunch with me now.

So on Friday, we sat down at the booth and I made room on my side for the other guy. He mentioned cooties, but sat down anyway. I immediately sprinkled cooties all over him, quite liberally! Cooties, cooties, cooties!

Be careful, Barbi, that could backfire! Some guys actually LIKE girl cooties!! :smt119
06-01-2009 12:30 PM
Sludge

The next time I see you two I'll make sure I have CP written in ink on the back of my hand.
06-01-2009 12:40 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by sskasser

Be careful, Barbi, that could backfire! Some guys actually LIKE girl cooties!! :smt119

I was telling the Mikes out at Jackson.... If a guy in interested in me, then he's a FREAK. He should think what that says about himself.

However, I would gladly sprinkle cooties on a guy, if I could get some dive gear in exchange!!!!!!
:rollguy
06-01-2009 12:41 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slüdge

The next time I see you two I'll make sure I have CP written in ink on the back of my hand.

And just WHERE were you? I expected to see you at a workshop function, but nooooooooooo.

CP? Cooties protection?
06-01-2009 12:43 PM
MORGAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slüdge

The next time I see you two I'll make sure I have CP written in ink on the back of my hand.

Let me guess - Cootie Proof?

Mike
06-01-2009 12:46 PM
MORGAN

Looks like Squirrel Girl and I were thinking the same thing at the same time - maybe we're receiving the messages from the mother ship on the same channel! :)

Mike
06-01-2009 12:51 PM
sskasser

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

And just WHERE were you? I expected to see you at a workshop function, but nooooooooooo.

CP? Cooties protection?

He was at JB yanking on Roger's fins! :rollguy

CP = "Cooties, Please!"
06-01-2009 12:57 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by sskasser

He was JB yanking on Roger's fins! :rollguy

That was a GREAT story. Personally, I'm glad you shaved your goatee, Shirley!
http://www.deepcaves.net/smilies/icon_winkle.gif
06-01-2009 01:17 PM
OFG-1

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

I immediately sprinkled cooties all over him, quite liberally! Cooties, cooties, cooties!

In honor of this honest revelation, I hereby bestow upon you:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i1...66/cooties.jpg

Now,please leave me alone.
06-01-2009 01:54 PM
Sludge

In the third grade it was a scientific fact that if you touched a girl you would get cooties. Unless, of course, you wrote "CP" on the back of your hand, for cootie protection. That way, if you accidentally touched a girl you were covered.

SG, one of my best friends got married on the day of the workshop. I believe she threatened me with cooties if I didn't go. But you'll be at the CDF Social, right?
06-01-2009 01:56 PM
Squirrel Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slüdge

SG, one of my best friends got married on the day of the workshop. I believe she threatened me with cooties if I didn't go. But you'll be at the CDF Social, right?

When I got back, I was talking to my boss and telling him how one of my buddies was thinking about heading to the Yucatan. He said, "The weather is really nice there around October 1st." Meaning--'you ain't going nowhere 'till after the start of the fiscal year.'
:mad:
06-01-2009 02:34 PM
Sludge

But we specifically scheduled this year's social for a holiday weekend for folks who have to come more than a few hundred miles.
06-01-2009 05:23 PM
MengTze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

Last Friday I had lunch with my usual group. One guy won't have lunch with me, if it's just the two of us and I tease him MERCILESSLY over that. MERCILESSLY. So bad that he actually will have lunch with me now.

So on Friday, we sat down at the booth and I made room on my side for the other guy. He mentioned cooties, but sat down anyway. I immediately sprinkled cooties all over him, quite liberally! Cooties, cooties, cooties!

So you pressured a poor little, impressionable, soul to have lunch with you at the risk of contracting cooties? Then proceeded to spew those all over him? No wonder you are not allowed to do that survey. That is just crazy!
06-01-2009 05:24 PM
MengTze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrel Girl

When I got back, I was talking to my boss and telling him how one of my buddies was thinking about heading to the Yucatan. He said, "The weather is really nice there around October 1st." Meaning--'you ain't going nowhere 'till after the start of the fiscal year.'
:mad:

And Karma bites back on that cootie spewing................

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