Sidemount VS Backmount

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Originally Posted by Spd 135

"Pretty" does not matter nearly as much as having the right "kit" for the dive.

This is a good discusson, but in reality both setups have their place for diving on the technical side. To say one is better than the other is just misinformed or talking out of turn.

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I think that SPD's post above is the most important statement made regarding the subject of this thread and it took a while to get to it, but there it is...

This thread started as a SM/BM discussion by SM'rs only with very close minded thinking regarding BM. I hopefully added a bit of balance, made you think a bit beyond, and step back some from a fairly high SM perch back there just before my first post. All food for thought, and maybe it is not so one sided now. That is what the OP said they wanted to begin with anyway.

My observations are first hand. I dive BM and do some pretty technical stuff - have all the OC cards to dive anywhere I will fit into, deep or shallow (depends on how much beer I have had). I started cave diving in the early 80's, had a break while raising kids and now am heavily back into it, thanks very much to a few old time cave diving locals.

I think there is a great deal of merit to the SM configuration where it really matters (low and wide), but other than that, BM IMO is very clean, simple, and my buddies for the most part dive it. I prefer it...I can think of one place I would like to go right now and can't get to that SM can. Would I dive SM - I will if another way is not found to get there.

IMO - The only thing wrong with BM or SM is the diver that puts them on.

"To say one is better than the other is just misinformed" - perfect! :-)

Bob

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Originally Posted by addexdiver

I have to disagree with you Forrest, I think that SPD's post above is the most important statement made regarding the subject of this thread and it took a while to get to it, but there it is...

This thread started as a SM/BM discussion by SM'rs only with very close minded thinking regarding BM. I hopefully added a bit of balance, made you think a bit beyond, and step back some from a fairly high SM perch back there just before my first post. All food for thought, and maybe it is not so one sided now. That is what the OP said they wanted to begin with anyway.

My observations are first hand. I dive BM and do some pretty technical stuff - have all the OC cards to dive anywhere I will fit into, deep or shallow (depends on how much beer I have had). I started cave diving in the early 80's, had a break while raising kids and now am heavily back into it, thanks very much to a few old time cave diving locals.

I think there is a great deal of merit to the SM configuration where it really matters (low and wide), but other than that, BM IMO is very clean, simple, and my buddies for the most part dive it. I prefer it...I can think of one place I would like to go right now and can't get to that SM can. Would I dive SM - I will if another way is not found to get there.

"To say one is better than the other is just misinformed" - perfect! :-)

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Although yes I think SM is better it is from diving both configurations extensively, I am not sure that many people have tried both methods extensively to the point of being proficient in both SM & BM then making a decision on what best suits them.
I did not mean to say that BM is useless as I dove that way for a long time, but after diving SM for a while I just do not see the point of BM for the kind of diving I like to do.
If you have to carry tanks in a dry cave or walk in the jungle for a while then have to rappel down a vertical sink to get to the water and want to do that with doubles, it makes no sense, and having no idea what kind of cave you will encounter makes SM way more flexible in my opinion.
I like having one simple rig that allows me to dive everything and go anywhere I want.
There are guys here who have not tried SM and who refuse to give it a chance, all I am saying is try it if you don't like it don't use it.

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Originally Posted by addexdiver

This thread started as a SM/BM discussion by SM'rs only with very close minded thinking regarding BM. I hopefully added a bit of balance, made you think a bit beyond, and step back some from a fairly high SM perch back there just before my first post. All food for thought, and maybe it is not so one sided now. That is what the OP said they wanted to begin with anyway.

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Have you dived SM enough to be profficient in it? If not, then you are making observations and assumptions rather than any informed decision based on practice.

I would say the GREAT majority of people who are sidemounting now, did NOT start that way. Instead they started in BM and swapped over, usually almost exclusively, to SM.

I understand your side of it(there was nothing new there), but I don't agree with them. Nor do I agree with your percieved observations. My disagreement isn't because I haven't dived BM, its because I have.

I do think every rig has its place though... If I were doing an open ocean tech dive tomorrow, it'd be with BM doubles. Mostly because I know I'll be on a rocking boat and its easier/safer to have everything attached already - LOL.

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Originally Posted by Spd 135

Do you sidemount as well as backmount?

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Originally Posted by FW

I think this is the most important question! ...

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Originally Posted by addexdiver

I have to disagree with you Forrest, I think that SPD's post above is the most important statement made regarding the subject of this thread and it took a while to get to it, but there it is...

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How do you compare a question to a statement?

I have no issues with backmount, I did it for 30 years. What I have issues with is, un-informed backmounters that don't like sidemount, because someone told them backmount was the only way to dive.

I'm diving almost nothing but sidemount now, well I guess I am nothing but sidemount now until I find a situation where back mount works better - which I would believe to be related to entry/exit.

Outside of the weight issue, I beleive backmount to be a superior entry/exit configuration, here is why - I just take my fins off and walk out. (obviously rap/sump situations change this)

Sidemount I have to unhook bungies, unhook a couple hoses, hope I'm not too wide for any stairs, and they ride on my hips kind of funny and hurt if I have to walk long distances, the obvious solution there is to take them off and carry them up one at time, I hate that and would rather just get it over with, back mount is not THAT heavy.

My biggest justification to me going sidemount is my primary diving is cave diving, if I did nothing but local quarry or wrecks I would not be side mounting, entry/exit is just too much of a pita.

That said after I figure out how to get my argon mount going the way I like it on sidemount, I may break down the rest of my doubles.

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Originally Posted by FW

How do you compare a question to a statement?

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You are correct - So I edited the post and eliminated the linkage. Nothing personal...

My point in the post and prior points still remain.

FWIW - I am drawing my own conclusions based on direct observation. Not as you imply. And I have nothing against SM - just providing a much needed balance to an otherwise heavily biased thread...IMO.

All the Best,
Bob

How direct are your observations? Are you proficient in sidemount yourself?

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Originally Posted by SuPrBuGmAn

How direct are your observations? Are you proficient in sidemount yourself?

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Valid - No. And I have nothing at all against it. I do have a bias against bias though. LOL - I have already said I dive BM...and I will dive SM if a way to the only non-BM place I want to go is not found. You may find it in my posts if you desire to do so. Again, I have absolutely nothing against SM, just providing a balance to the rather heavy bias in this thread.

Does one have to jump out of an airplane without a parachute to know what they are looking at?

Wait - don't answer that... :-)

Lighten up folks - I get the feeling I did just crash the HQ party for the SM glee club...am I the only BM diver stupid enough to walk through the door...come on, be a good host and at least hand me a beer!

Bob

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Originally Posted by SuPrBuGmAn

...I do think every rig has its place though... If I were doing an open ocean tech dive tomorrow, it'd be with BM doubles. Mostly because I know I'll be on a rocking boat and its easier/safer to have everything attached already - LOL.

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The last time I used doubles in the ocean, I thought I was going to end up there permanently. We went out to a wreck in 2ft seas, and when we got back to the boat, there were 6ft seas. I had to wait and watch the ladder plunging into the water, then jerking out, for several wave cycles. I waited until I could time it to grab the ladder, and let the boat pull me out of the water. Then I had to climb like hell to get on board before getting dunked and washed off the ladder. Y'all can have ocean diving!

FWIW Bob, I am not sure it would have been any easier in sidemount, except I might have been able to tie the tanks on lines, and let the crew pull them up, like they were doing with all the single tank divers.

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Originally Posted by addexdiver

Valid - Again, I have absolutely nothing against SM, just providing a balance to the rather heavy bias in this thread.


Lighten up folks - I get the feeling I did just crash the HQ party for the SM glee club...am I the only BM diver stupid enough to walk through the door...come on, be a good host and at least hand me a beer!

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Got to give you credit on these point. If you were not the only one with a CON opinion the thread would be closed by now. There is only so much back slapping that everyone can do before it gets old. Its so much more interesting to have a scape goat. Of course once you have perfected your game here you can go over to the DIR forun on TDS and make a few non-DIR comment there.

John