Guys 230 inches is 5.842 meters...from my convert program......or 19.16667 feetQuote:
Originally Posted by FW
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Guys 230 inches is 5.842 meters...from my convert program......or 19.16667 feetQuote:
Originally Posted by FW
Yep, you are right. My point was, it isn't deep, and I was just harassing Duncan for hitting the " key, instead of the ' key :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by spelodiver
I think everyone realises that I meant ' rather than " ... ;-)Quote:
Originally Posted by FW
I was taught the SI at school and had to use Google to convert between metres and feet for the benefit of my friends from Our Former Colonies.
I find that your use of old fashoned units is rather quaint - a bit like the way you spell some words.
Duncan, when you write "metre" instead of "meter," we're thrown for such a loop that we can't think any more.
Easy: "metre" is a unit of distance invented by that French cad, General Bonaparte, and "meter" is a device for measuring something such as electricity discovered by that fine gentleman, Sir Humphrey Davy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slüdge
Sorry! I should have wrote 38 and 30 fathoms respectively.
Got watch people who have "tyres" on their cars.
I'm perhaps one of the rare individuals who is proud of my British Isles heritage but prouder still to be a "former" colonist as I wouldn't trade our Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights for anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan Price
OK were haveing too much fun with this....Quote:
Originally Posted by WEPIV
I have to admit that at one point many years ago I was in the tunnel under henleys castle SOLO on air....don't really remember much just that the dive seemed to go really fast..my log says max 211ft....and the note about deco said 20min more than dive plan...Deco at end was on o2..........
Do the British spell proper names the same way the person using the name does? Check my signature line, then your website :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan Price
Clearly you spell your own name wrong :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by FW
Stop fighting you two ;)
NOW! ;D
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Originally Posted by CaveMD
I didn't want you to stop the discussion here ... just to stop fighting ;)
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Originally Posted by OH
The bottom of Ruedi Reservoir is 240' deep to the floor.
A cowboy from neaby Basalt managed to drive himself into the reservoir after inbibing in an all niter at a local bar. I was called out on a recovery with Rocky Mtn S & R to search for his pick-up & his body. Late November, & snowing, two of us entered the lake. Surface temperature was near freezing.
We were on air & hit 170' and no where near the floor of the reservoir. Even in dry suits, it was cold. I thumbed the dive because i felt it unsafe & stupid. This was years before EAN or Tri-mix were even available to the general public.
If you are diving deep, do the math & fill with what the dive calls for. It is available & makes for common sense !
For what it's worth !
JE
What's air?
Damnit, here we go again...
Been there.?....
Gggggggtttytt
Drum role please.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spareparts06
Marci has a great "narc'd" story where I just put the reel down on the cave floor and kept swimming on in Lower Lower Orange Grove. After she got done freaking out over me just leaving the reel and swimming off, she finally noticed I'd tied it into the gold line. Obviously she blanked the whole "tying in to the gold line" part, and while I'm pretty fair with lines and reasonably fast, I'm not that fast, especially at 130 ft.
Based on that and other experiences, I pretty much plan to limit her END to around 100-110' as she does not function to our personal standards below that, so that becomes the END for our team dives. I have however noted that she does a little better in terms of situational awareness and general function with a scooter in places like Ginnie and Little River with flow and 100'ish depths, so I suspect elevated CO2 levels increase the narcosis she experiences when swimming into flow.
Solo, I might go as deep as 130' on a non stressful cave dive in ideal conditions in very familiar cave, but I can't right off think of a valid reason to do that.
plus one. on all my shallow Mexico stuff we use air diluentQuote:
Originally Posted by DA Aquamaster
To date all my dives through Apprentice were on air. In OW I like a little helium past 150'. I imagine the same will be true as I progress through cave training.
I've never been in a cave on air. Period.
Hopefully someday though.
Sent from my Shearwater Predator...
I think the following article offers a more balanced / less hysterical view on deep air diving:
A PRACTICAL DISCUSSION OF NITROGEN NARCOSIS FOR DEEP DIVING
Excellent article, thanks for posting the link.
QUOTE: Garth
I've never been in a cave on air.
+1
I saw the Witch of Wookey on air... when I was about 10 yrs old. Since then I prefer Jim Wyatt's banked 30.
Like many people, mr Gilliam puts the blame for narcosis largely on nitrogen. While nitrogen (and oxygen) have a rather large narcotic potential, CO2 is the gas to be really aware of. Deep diving on air may not be a problem for experienced divers as long as everything is nice and easy. But you have to realise air is not easy to breathe, at 30 metres (90ft) our ventilation is half as efficient as on the surface. If we have to work hard, like in an emergency situation, we produce CO2 faster, and we are not able to get rid of it because of our inpaired ventilation. So CO2 narcosis kicks in, and this is the real risk of deep air diving. Not nitrogen narcosis.Quote:
Originally Posted by NEON
I will never again dive below 90ft on air in a cave, and probably not even in open water. I did deep air dives in the past, up to 250ft, and survived. I was lucky.
This should have been the very first thing in his article and repeated within every section.
"All divers should exercise prudence and reasonable caution in all aspects of deep diving but particularly so when it comes to narcosis. Experience is vital before attempting progressively deeper dives. Ideally, the diver should be seeking out the benefit of training by a competent, well-experienced deep diving instructor before a penetration below “entry level/open water” training diving depths. Don’t try to obtain field experience on your own or with another buddy. The historical record provides too many fatalities or near misses due to narcosis to warrant such a risk."
When diving places like LR & Devils I have enough narcosis that it is notable. There have been times when, for me and in my opinion, the reason for the dive made diving deep air worth the added risk. However it is important to understand that I fully understand that it is/was higher risk. Unfortunately far too many dive deep air without understanding the risk or even having enough experience to accurately evaluate it. I agree that training should be properly focused on the understanding of the risk and gaining experience. The reality is that with present day training the focus is on boxing training into a neat package to move divers through to the next level/round of training instead of gaining experience and complete competence. The "good old days" were not any better as we did not have a firm understanding and divers, such as myself, wound up jumping in the "deep end" without really knowing what we were getting into. A lot of luck went into getting through the dives and gaining the needed experience. I don't have the magic solution, what I do know is that divers too often look at what others have done and assume they can do it without having the needed experience. Deep air always stacks the deck against the diver and if taken lightly or the endeavor taken with too little experience will quickly kill the diver and often enough their teammates.
I was expecting a GUE link from you ;o)
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Originally Posted by Mart
What is the significance of this deep air dive being done solo? Is my narcosis level supposed to be affected by my being by myself? If this is the premis, I guess I have never experienced any difference in my narcosis levels diving solo rather than with a partner.
I think that there are quite a few instances where someone got very narced, and it was their buddy that called the dive / stopped things from getting bad.
270 has been my limit
I would say that these types of incidents occur whenever divers with vastly different narcosis tolerance levels dive together;and the least tolerant diver is going beyond his own experience/comfort level.Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot
today, maybe not more than 240 in a cave and maybe 300 in clear water
Thats what you think. Where I live the closest Nitrox is a 210mile round trip. And cost $14.00 per/cylinder and $45.00 for gasoline.Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot
It ain't hard at all to "roll your own" with Nitrox, or tri-mix for that matterQuote:
Originally Posted by darkdiver211
Thats true
I have a baby KISS booster for sale if anyone is interested ... ;)
I'm with Curt...and ten-plus years older....so my #'s would be 200 cave and 250 OW......but I'd only do it if there was NO possibility of getting any He, and it was a once in lifetime, "bucket list" dive.
Did 100's of 300-plus dives on air in younger days.....the max keeps getting shallower....risk/reward, been there/done that issue becomes more of a priority!
In the US, maybe. It is hard to find O2 in third world countries, and next to impossible to get He. North Florida is the *only* place I have cave dived that has banked nitrox and normoxic trimix.Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot
48m (that's metres for you guys) is it for me but I'm not that comfortable with it so everything else needs to be on side; good vis, not cold, not much exertion, familiar cave, easy cave, built up depth over recent dives...
I am comfortable at 40m.
Twenty five years ago when I knew no better I did a few air dives to 68M. Now 40M is enough.
Andrew