And yet the first 1000ft of those caves has had more deaths than I think any of us really want to list off.Quote:
Originally Posted by inverted_bear
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And yet the first 1000ft of those caves has had more deaths than I think any of us really want to list off.Quote:
Originally Posted by inverted_bear
I think it was Steve Lewis that said the rule of thirds guarantees that the majority of bodies will be recovered near the entrance to the caves.Quote:
Originally Posted by PfcAJ
I'm paraphrasing, I can't remember the exact wording of the quote.
Most of them were probably better divers than I am , but I would be interested to see what proportion of those divers went past the first 1000' during part of their dives. There's a lot more dangerous sections of devil's further back that could easily delay the exit and cause the divers to run out of gas. Not that a complete siltout or other emergency couldn't happen in the front, but it's much less likely than in the back. There would also be a lot more distance to cover through deeper sections on the 2/3's + reserved for exit in the back.
Please don't take any of my posts as me trying to be a know it all. I learn best through discussions and debating; it's just how I am. I don't intend to sound pretentious or arrogant (even if I do come across that way).
Another thing to consider is that if you are in an underwater cave and you become disoriented or incapacitated due to a contaminated gas supply, a medical issue, or other reason you are very unlikely to survive unless you have another cave diver there to assist you. I can think of several incidents which would be fatalities but for the actions of a dive buddy.
Of course the flip side is there are also several incidents where poor decisions from one diver may have created challenges that doomed the whole team.
Outside of scenarios involving extremely constricted passage, one of the best things to bring on any cave dive for both safety and enjoyment is a capable dive partner.
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All the examples in "Blueprint for Survival" were based on real accidents. Sheck changed the names out of respect for the families.Quote:
Originally Posted by patpicos
You just had to add "capable", eh?
Irrefutable stance even though the merits of solo diving can still be debated.
And enjoyed! Apparently I was on a very relaxing solo dive yesterday when my three buddies disturbed my reverie to get me to aim the strobe differently.
Inconsiderate pricks! (Mods-please insert an acceptable word if required.)
Bob
One of the worst silt outs I ever saw was the front half of Ginnie, from the Hill 400 jump to the cavern. Had done a long dive and was scootering out, when I hit a wall of chocolate milk right at Hill 400. I was in disbelief,but reality is reality. Had to get on the line, and what normally took a couple minutes to exit on DPV, became a feel your way out swim dive. Never trusted the "Ginnie never silts out" people like to use when justifying pushing limits to use flow and water clarity. FWIW, by the time most people have the ability to see the back of Ginnie, they typically have silt control etc under control. Hence, you are probably in greater danger in the front half of any cave since everyone has to a traverse this regardless of how far they are going.Quote:
Originally Posted by inverted_bear
There's also the familiarity breeds complacency argument. I'd bet that most "extreme" cave dives have more safety precautions than the average Wednesday night Ginnie dive.
Some people seem to take a cavalier attitude towards the front of the cave due to how close to the exit it is. I've heard comments along the lines of, "you could swim from the catacombs out the Ear holding your breath if you really had to". I think people forget how many bodies have been pulled from the catacombs and areas near the exit.
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I agree with that and I'm sure it's fairly easy to find good buddies when you live within driving distance of caves. It's way harder to find buddies that aren't strangers when you only get to dive caves when you travel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus
So, it's not really an option for everyone. Depending on the buddy, I might even feel safer diving by myself... when I dive with new people, I get a bit nervous at times.