BBC Write Up of Mallorca Incident and Rescue

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07-17-2017 08:35 AM
BigTex1836

BBC Write Up of Mallorca Incident and Rescue

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-40558067
07-17-2017 01:41 PM
MarkR

I would like to hear more about how the buddy made it out. That had to take some thick stones to go back into the zero viz looking for the way out.

Glad it turned out ok. From the article, it sounded like maybe nobody knew where they were? I would think a dive plan would be SOP for exploration work. No?
07-17-2017 04:32 PM
gianaameri

This is really well done.

The audio interview is very useful.

The one bit I do not understand from the translated audio interview is where Xisco says that the O2 must have been at 16% because the CO2 was at 5% in the dry chamber where he took refuge.

I will ask Xisco next time I see him if he actually said that and if a. he believes that, or b. if it is a translation error.

I think it may be worthwhile anyway to measure not just CO2, but also O2 simultneously in the various dry chambers of Mallorca in terms of data collection.
07-18-2017 05:00 AM
gianaameri

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adler

I would like to hear more about how the buddy made it out.

What I understand having pieced together all the various reports, and having looked at the cave topo (a limited, but relevant portion) is that Xisco and Guiem (the "buddies") after having separated to do independent tasks with a view to meet outside the cave some time later, both coincided on the way out in the same spot and found no cave line and the place silted (according to the recount).

They spent an hour together looking for the line and they could not find it, and then they went to a dry sections and agreed that Guiem would attempt the exit taking the remaining available gas and raise the alarm.

There are two ways to that dry section location according to the topo.

One is reported to have had a continuous guideline, but my understanding is that it was found not to be there while the "buddies" were exiting the cave. So, that one way way out had no guideline and was silted and had already been searched for one hour by the lost "team."

My understanding is that Guiem then took the other way out after discussions in the dry-section and went out as fast as possible and found the vis. to be good.

However, I asked Xisco this morning for clarification, but he may not know being the one trapped in the cave, I do not think Guiem placed a jump line on the way out to close the known gap/jump.

Treat this as speculation on my part. So, now there are two galleries both silted and with no continuous guideline leading to Xisco.

Then two divers attempted the rescue without alerting the emergency services and this added more silt, and it did not work out...

So, the difficulties getting to Xisco's known position was due to silt and may have been (my speculation at this point in time, but I saw the topo to be used for the eventual international rescue I was organizing) a lack of a continuous guideline on both of the two known passages leading to the dry-section where Xisco took refuge.

Only Xisco or Guiem or the two rescue divers Freddy and/or Bernat may be able to confirm the lack of continuous guideline at the beginning of the rescue, because the other two rescue divers (one from the Guardia Civil and the other from the Spanish mainland) which had been flown in by helicopter only entered the cave after contact was first made with Xisco early Monday evening (Saturday was the day of the incident) and a direct continuous guideline reinstated with all junctions removed to facilitate Xisco's exit.
07-23-2017 03:53 PM
gianaameri

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...derwater-cave/
08-05-2017 03:36 PM
gianaameri

Quote:

Originally Posted by gianaameri

What I understand having pieced together all the various reports, and having looked at the cave topo (a limited, but relevant portion) is that Xisco and Guiem (the "buddies") after having separated to do independent tasks with a view to meet outside the cave some time later, both coincided on the way out in the same spot and found no cave line and the place silted (according to the recount).

They spent an hour together looking for the line and they could not find it, and then they went to a dry sections and agreed that Guiem would attempt the exit taking the remaining available gas and raise the alarm.

There are two ways to that dry section location according to the topo.

One is reported to have had a continuous guideline, but my understanding is that it was found not to be there while the "buddies" were exiting the cave. So, that one way way out had no guideline and was silted and had already been searched for one hour by the lost "team."

My understanding is that Guiem then took the other way out after discussions in the dry-section and went out as fast as possible and found the vis. to be good.

However, I asked Xisco this morning for clarification, but he may not know being the one trapped in the cave, I do not think Guiem placed a jump line on the way out to close the known gap/jump.

Treat this as speculation on my part. So, now there are two galleries both silted and with no continuous guideline leading to Xisco.

Then two divers attempted the rescue without alerting the emergency services and this added more silt, and it did not work out...

So, the difficulties getting to Xisco's known position was due to silt and may have been (my speculation at this point in time, but I saw the topo to be used for the eventual international rescue I was organizing) a lack of a continuous guideline on both of the two known passages leading to the dry-section where Xisco took refuge.

Only Xisco or Guiem or the two rescue divers Freddy and/or Bernat may be able to confirm the lack of continuous guideline at the beginning of the rescue, because the other two rescue divers (one from the Guardia Civil and the other from the Spanish mainland) which had been flown in by helicopter only entered the cave after contact was first made with Xisco early Monday evening (Saturday was the day of the incident) and a direct continuous guideline reinstated with all junctions removed to facilitate Xisco's exit.

I coincided in the same cave today with Xisco and his buddy Guiem and had the opportunity to ask both the question.

It is confirmed there was no continuous guideline to reach the dry section Xisco took refuge in.
08-14-2017 09:14 AM
gianaameri

Quote:

Originally Posted by gianaameri

This is really well done.

The audio interview is very useful.

The one bit I do not understand from the translated audio interview is where Xisco says that the O2 must have been at 16% because the CO2 was at 5% in the dry chamber where he took refuge.

I will ask Xisco next time I see him if he actually said that and if a. he believes that, or b. if it is a translation error.

I think it may be worthwhile anyway to measure not just CO2, but also O2 simultneously in the various dry chambers of Mallorca in terms of data collection.

We measured some caves this morning for CO2, T, Rh, and O2... and with 5.4% CO2 (naturally occurring in the cave this time of the year and not produced by humans entering the cave) we measured concurrently 17.2% O2.

So, from a very first and small sample of data (I started measuring CO2 in all dry sections of sub-aquatic caves to determine survivability/refuge), a natural rise in CO2 in the cave seems to produce a drop in O2 as Xisco described in the BBC audio interview... hence he survived in high CO2 and low O2 environment for a prolonged period (adding CO2 and reducing O2 in the process).