cave diver training tunnels what do you think??

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05-18-2005 01:46 AM
shazza

cave diver training tunnels what do you think??

Hi guys!,
I am an industrial designer and I am designing products for cave divers. I would like to design a training tunnel to be used by cave divers in swimminng pools in the early stages of the cave diver course.

The tunnel would be made of tranparent material to allow the instructor to see the diver, and also an easy escape hatch for if something goes wrong. The tunnel would be simmilar in design to childrens play tunnels and therefore fold easily and be easily transported.

I would really appreciate any information or feedback on the idea and the detail of the design, such as:

What to make length? Diameter? Changing Diameter?
Shape Of tunnel, Straight of Curved?
Inside texture of tunnels?
What kinds of skills could be practised in the tunnels?ie anti-silting?
I have heard from some sources that concrete practise tunnels exsist already in swimming pools, is this true and if so what are they like? size/length/ Shape?
How many Austrailan are cavedivers?

I would love to hear any suggstions, feedback or even critisisms on the concept.

Thanxs guys hope to hear from you all!!
Shazz :lol:
05-18-2005 06:10 AM
FW

I have seen the childrens wire loop tunnels used in pools. The idea was to test students for claustraphobia. If the student got into trouble, the instructor just pulled the whole thing onto the surface.

There has been some discussion of building a "training park" in old limestone quarries in Florida.

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05-18-2005 06:27 AM
DeWayne

Quote:

Originally Posted by FW

I have seen the childrens wire loop tunnels used in pools. The idea was to test students for claustraphobia. If the student got into trouble, the instructor just pulled the whole thing onto the surface.

There has been some discussion of building a "training park" in old limestone quarries in Florida.

PM sent

Was this done with the clear, or the opaque plastic? Seems like the clear might not produce the desired effects to truly test for claustrophobia in all cases. Such a false positive could have bad results later by the instructor letting his guard down.
05-18-2005 08:32 AM
BobK

Re: cave diver training tunnels what do you think??

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazza

Hi guys!,
I am an industrial designer and I am designing products for cave divers. I would like to design a training tunnel to be used by cave divers in swimminng pools in the early stages of the cave diver course.

I think very few swimming pools would allow enough "cave" to be worth much training-wise. I think you'd have to build something in a decent sized quarry to allow any kind of realistic training environment. Maybe have trapdoors every so often in the top of the "cave" which would lead to a fresh air pocket, allowing a panicked diver to recover without allowing them to bolt to the surface and risk injury.

Not sure if there would be much of a demand for something like this, though. The only commercially viable idea I can think of is if you put something like this in SeaWorld, and charged OW divers $100 to swim through the "cave". The downside, of course, would be that some of them would then think they were cave trained :(
05-18-2005 09:32 AM
Tegg

What is wrong with simply going back to the "old school" of training cavedivers?

Is cavediving so mainstream now that we should "baby" new cavedivers?

If you're going to dive in a real cave, you should train in one.
05-18-2005 09:53 AM
DogDiver

Great idea, thou implementation would be hard. I would check with Mike Williams at Gilboa Quarry in Findlay Ohio. Mike has been working with the idea of an overhead training area in his very popular open water training site. For those folks up north, this would be a great training idea and skills review. I know in the past when I lived in Michigan, we cavers would go to White Star Quarry, in Gibsonburg, OH. It has a cement tunnel of about 150 feet that goes from 45 to 65 feet and is the only place for skills reviews in a black overhead enviornment. www.divegilboa.com
thanks Ken...
05-18-2005 10:14 AM
BobK

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tegg

What is wrong with simply going back to the "old school" of training cavedivers?

Is cavediving so mainstream now that we should "baby" new cavedivers?

If you're going to dive in a real cave, you should train in one.

It might be more a location issue than anything. I can pop up to Florida cave country for a day's worth of cave diving, but that is somewhat harder for divers from, say, Kansas, I would guess.

AFIK, all cave training is still done in caves to this point, and I agree that the real environment is really best for training.
05-18-2005 10:18 AM
mpoucher

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tegg

What is wrong with simply going back to the "old school" of training cavedivers?

Is cavediving so mainstream now that we should "baby" new cavedivers?

If you're going to dive in a real cave, you should train in one.

The answer to this is conservation. Why practice in a "real cave"? Get your skills down in a safer, less fragile environment before going into a cave. I've heard stories of instructors that use to have students run reels in the river, upstream, as practice. We've all seen and done line drills in open water. Once the basic skills are down, then go into the cave for the "real" training. I think you learn more if you can already do the skill and can concentrate on applying the technique in the cave.
05-18-2005 11:51 AM
Signal 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tegg

What is wrong with simply going back to the "old school" of training cavedivers?

Is cavediving so mainstream now that we should "baby" new cavedivers?

If you're going to dive in a real cave, you should train in one.

why destroy a beautiful cave with untrained divers? Learn your finning techiques and line drills in open water, then bring it into the cave. And atleast pick a part of the cave that isnt so fragile to be teaching lost line drills and lights out exercises. I mean come on Joe, look at how badly you've messed up Waynes World with your technique :-D jk
05-18-2005 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titen

why destroy a beautiful cave with untrained divers?

Untrained divers shouldn't be in cave courses in the first place. My instructor wouldn't teach even Cavern to anyone until they had 100 open water dives and could demonstrate excellent skills. But then again, he taught for the love of diving, and not for the money.

Russell