Dry cave question

[phillip1]

I know Forrest explained me this a while ago but I forgot and this question may seem really really stupid to dry cavers coming from an ignorant cave diver like myself
but how do you mark your way out in dry caves?

[john844]

We usually don't. There are some rare ocassions where we will use pieces of flagging tape to temporarily mark the way, but we don't leave them in the cave when we leave.

Some cavers see this as cave trash and will remove them as they pass through the cave. You better be paying attention to your surroundings just in case someone comes in behind you cleaning your trail.

[Slüdge]

No bread crumbs?

[john844]

There were only 2 caves that we used bread crumbs of flagging. In Ellison's cave, the through trip (similar to a traverse) under the mountain covers miles of passages that look very similar. There are bread crumbs left in that cave to help others learn the route.

Sometimes we would stack a few rocks into a small pyramid to indicate a deviation from what might look like the obvious route. Usually we just expored the cave frequently looking back at what the cave looks like for the exit. Since we didn't have time constraints for air, getting confused only ended up in minor delays while we looked for something we recognized.

[jlillest]

We usually don't. There are some rare ocassions where we will use pieces of flagging tape to temporarily mark the way, but we don't leave them in the cave when we leave.

John's right, but there are some occasions when we leave stuff. In especially mazy sections or really difficult to find leads, we'll leave some sort of marker. There's a cave that we're exploring in VA that has a breakdown lead (crawly) in the middle of a giant, mostly featureless room. Without some sort of marker to lead the way to the exit some of us might still be there, given that the room and the cave are relatively unknown.

Another way to do it is by using survey stations. We mark survey stations such that when you need to return to find it, sometimes 10 or more years later, then you can pick up your survey without having to make something up. You can choose what to use for this, but we opt for finger nail polish or carbide because you can always make it disappear years later with a bit of mud.

For more popular caves, the elephant tracks usually lead the way.....

-Jon

[FW]

...For more popular caves, the elephant tracks usually lead the way.....

The only problem there is dead ends end up with twice as many tracks, in and then out

There are some "boy scout" caves where kids have spray painted arrows on the walls to find their way out. The biggest problem there is they all use different systems, so the arrows don't really do you any good.

The saving grace is if you do get lost, you don't have to worry about running out of air. You can live a long time without food, and a few days without water. Without air is a totally different matter.

[Squirrel Girl]

Some people use plastic spoons or popsicle sticks with a piece of reflective tape on them as removable markers.

[phillip1]

really no exit markers at all? I have done some dry caving but nothing to were you would get lost at all mostly just to get to a nearby sump to dive the flodded part but in some of the caves I dive like Cenote Doggi or La Jeringa whichg are really maze like I imagine those caves dry and how hard it would be to find your way out without some sort of exit marking.
Has anyone ever got lost to the point of a fatality in dry caves?

[FW]

..Has anyone ever got lost to the point of a fatality in dry caves?

Not that I remember. There have been some searches, though.

[d_berman]

Has anyone ever got lost ...

I typically reference it as "temporarily disoriented" vs the "L" word (particularly if leading scouts or novices, they get so nervous if they hear the "L..." word)