Ginnie Cave Diver Prices at Ginnie for the Social

[Bill Rotella]

Folks,

If you are just diving for one day, then your entry fee will be the regular price of $20.00, but if you want to dive any two (2) days of this social weekend, then let the front office know, and you can save yourself $5.00!

See you at the social.

Bill Rotella

[DeWayne]

Gee, Ginnie is going all out to be generous there. Why not have everyone pool their massive savings and hire a security guard to ensure that nothing walks off, as is usual for Ginnie. Hope you guys have fun though, and watch out for each others gear. We are headed to Huntsville for the NSS.

[Tegg]

Gee, Ginnie is going all out to be generous there. Why not have everyone pool their massive savings and hire a security guard to ensure that nothing walks off, as is usual for Ginnie.

Last I checked "security" is provided with the $20 admission to Ginnie... or at least that is what the guy that hangs out by Little Devil called himself.

I would think that we would not need to pay extra above the cost of entry for something that Ginnie graciously provides. :?:

Ginnie had "security" posted at the CDF Social last year and I'm sure they're going to do it again this year. I asked Bill R. to check on this (he's our Ginnie contact for the July 2nd CDF Social).

[Bishop]

Ask the divers who 'lost' their scooters over Memorial Day weekend how well the security worked.

Ask the divers who 'lost' their scooters over Memorial Day weekend how well the security worked.
Who do I ask? No one has admitted they lost anything.

http://cavediver.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1907&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=20

If someone tells us exactly what was stolen with a make, model, description and serial number we can collectively help look for it.

I don't want to buy something that was stolen. I want the item returned to its owner and the person who stole it put in jail!

[cavman]

Ask the divers who 'lost' their scooters over Memorial Day weekend how well the security worked.
Who do I ask? No one has admitted they lost anything.

http://cavediver.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1907&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=20

If someone tells us exactly what was stolen with a make, model, description and serial number we can collectively help look for it.

I don't want to buy something that was stolen. I want the item returned to its owner and the person who stole it put in jail!

You can ask me. I had two Voyager Scooters stolen from the deck by Little Devils over Memorial Day Weekend. These are Mako-like scooters, black with Green trim. We reported this to the Ginnie Staff, notified a local sheriff's officer and filed a police report. I don't expect to ever see the scooters again.

We waited until later in the evening so as to avoid a lot of the crowd. We arrived at Ginnie around 8pm and I carried both scooters down to the water. There were too many swimmers and tubers at the steps and I couldn't physically get myself to the water. I placed both scooters side-by-side as near to the steps as I could, but out of the way of the swimmers/tubers who were coming and going. I walked back to the truck (50' from the scooters) donned my drysuit and immediately returned to put the scooters into the water. I only had my back turned for 10 minutes and both scooters had disappeared.

Obviously, I bear full responsibilty for leaving expensive dive gear unattended, but until that night, I never expected that someone would walk off with 100+lbs of dive gear, in a matter of minutes. Unfortunately, I learned my lesson the hard way.

Be very, very careful this weekend. If anyone should hear of two black and green scooters being sold cheap anywhere, please let me know.

James - 954-592-4080

James,

I'm sorry to hear your scooters were stolen and thanks for letting us know. I will be looking this weekend and on all my dive trips. I know lots of people also keep an eye on e-bay. Do you know of any distinctive markings, i.e. serial numbers, on these scooters (maybe on the warrantee paperwork)? This could have happened to anyone of us and I hope the person who stole these scooters is caught.

The Inspiration Rebreather list helped catch a person who stole a couple of Inspiration Rebreathers. The word got out, with the serial numbers, and someone noticed something fishy on E-bay. A meeting was setup with a police officer and the thief went to jail. My point is that some of these people do get caught and hopefully by getting the word out we can have a chance to catch them.

Also, with the technology of security cameras, I'm surprised more dive sites don't have them. I know Blue Springs, Orange City has at least one camera at the spring head. They don't cost much and they help prevent problems!

[DeWayne]

Also, with the technology of security cameras, I'm surprised more dive sites don't have them. I know Blue Springs, Orange City has at least one camera at the spring head. They don't cost much and they help prevent problems!

Memorial Day was actually a slow weekend for Ginnie; all I heard of getting stolen were James's two scooters and Linda's deco bottle. Such occurrences are far too common place at Ginnie and the primary reason that I refuse to go there. For the money they charge it would not be that hard to at least ensure our safety while topside on their property. I am waiting for some cave diver with the time and wherewithall to challenge Ginnie's utter disregard for these matters in court one day. The argument that they have someone watching just does not wash with me as we continue to hear about items sprouting legs and walking off. Perhaps they should attempt to actively enforce keeping the swimmers out of the divers' entrance area. I know that the swimmers bring in far more cash each day and that is their primary motive for being, but for what they charge to dive there they should be able to offer something more than "sorry to hear about your loss!" Until they take proactive steps to put a halt to this there will be those such as myself who refuse to go there (I have even gone as far as to tell instructors to forget about using the Devil's system as a training site with me unless they plan to boat in.) I don't think what we're asking for is any more out of line than what they charge to dive there; all we are asking for is to get what we paid for.

[Rich]

Memorial Day was actually a slow weekend for Ginnie; all I heard of getting stolen were James's two scooters and Linda's deco bottle. Such occurrences are far too common place at Ginnie and the primary reason that I refuse to go there. For the money they charge it would not be that hard to at least ensure our safety while topside on their property. I am waiting for some cave diver with the time and wherewithall to challenge Ginnie's utter disregard for these matters in court one day. The argument that they have someone watching just does not wash with me as we continue to hear about items sprouting legs and walking off. Perhaps they should attempt to actively enforce keeping the swimmers out of the divers' entrance area. I know that the swimmers bring in far more cash each day and that is their primary motive for being, but for what they charge to dive there they should be able to offer something more than "sorry to hear about your loss!" Until they take proactive steps to put a halt to this there will be those such as myself who refuse to go there (I have even gone as far as to tell instructors to forget about using the Devil's system as a training site with me unless they plan to boat in.) I don't think what we're asking for is any more out of line than what they charge to dive there; all we are asking for is to get what we paid for.


Dewayne, no offense but that's an idiotic post.....

I dive Ginnie on a daily basis, the staff there are extrememly friendly and extremely helpful, I'm good friends with most of them and I've never had anything stolen.

Of course I take personal responsiblity for my gear and don't whine about there being no security..like at Telford right :roll:.....if you just act sensibly and don't leave your stuff laying around for any Tom, Dick or Harry to walk off with then it won't get taken.

Do you leave your car unlocked with the keys in it and then whine when someone drives off with it? Ginnie makes their money off of campers (drunks) and tubers and they don't owe cave divers anything, I'm just thankful that we can access a premier system from their park.

I'm sorry you don't dive Ginnie, you're really missing out but it means it's less crowded for the rest of us!! And $300 a year to dive 24/7 is a pretty good deal in my book, with all the facilities, hot showers, deli food, dive shop on site etc!!

BTW I just came from the CDF social and they're already having an absolute blast down there....... :-D

Safe diving,

Rich

[cavman]

As I mentioned above, I bear responsibility for the loss; however, it would have been helpful if I could have received a little more assistance from the Staff. The best that they could offer was a "lost & found" entry in their book. They check every car entering and leaving the property to ensure that no one snuck in and that everyone paid to be there, but there wasn't even the offer of searching vehicles as they left. Considering the enormous $$$ taken in on a holiday weekend, they should probably consider hiring additional staff for these big holiday weekends. I'm sure that Ginnie could afford to bring in an additional 6-8 people to ensure everyone's safety and well being. Again, I don't blame Ginnie or the employees per se, but I'm sure that they could do more to protect their paying clientele...how many arrests were made over Memorial Day weekend? It is no secret what goes on. They should do something to help prevent these problems.

Rich - be careful with the word never. I've been going to Ginnie for 10+ years, and until Memorial Day, I had never had anything stolen either. I'm sure that we have all carried deco bottles or stage bottles or scooters to the waters edge with the intention of carrying them into the water with us. It literally took less than 10 minutes for someone to disappear with two scooters that were less than 50' from my parked car. I'm sure that if Ginnie were to hire one or two extra staff and place them at the entry/ exit points, it would eliminate a lot of problems and hopefully discourage anywould be thiefs.

Unfortunately, there were no distinguishing marks on these scooters. They are Aeris Voyagers, they look like Makos with green trim around the middle. The serial number for one is 002703. I'll have to find the police report to get the # for the other.

I'm glad to hear that everyone is having a great time at the social. And I hope that no one else has to experience a loss like mine. Rich is absolutely correct. Do not let your equipment out of your site.

[Rich]

As I mentioned above, I bear responsibility for the loss; however, it would have been helpful if I could have received a little more assistance from the Staff. The best that they could offer was a "lost & found" entry in their book. They check every car entering and leaving the property to ensure that no one snuck in and that everyone paid to be there, but there wasn't even the offer of searching vehicles as they left. Considering the enormous $$$ taken in on a holiday weekend, they should probably consider hiring additional staff for these big holiday weekends. I'm sure that Ginnie could afford to bring in an additional 6-8 people to ensure everyone's safety and well being. Again, I don't blame Ginnie or the employees per se, but I'm sure that they could do more to protect their paying clientele...how many arrests were made over Memorial Day weekend? It is no secret what goes on. They should do something to help prevent these problems.

Rich - be careful with the word never. I've been going to Ginnie for 10+ years, and until Memorial Day, I had never had anything stolen either. I'm sure that we have all carried deco bottles or stage bottles or scooters to the waters edge with the intention of carrying them into the water with us. It literally took less than 10 minutes for someone to disappear with two scooters that were less than 50' from my parked car. I'm sure that if Ginnie were to hire one or two extra staff and place them at the entry/ exit points, it would eliminate a lot of problems and hopefully discourage anywould be thiefs.

Unfortunately, there were no distinguishing marks on these scooters. They are Aeris Voyagers, they look like Makos with green trim around the middle. The serial number for one is 002703. I'll have to find the police report to get the # for the other.

I'm glad to hear that everyone is having a great time at the social. And I hope that no one else has to experience a loss like mine. Rich is absolutely correct. Do not let your equipment out of your site.

Hiya James!!

Yeah, I know we spoke after your scooters "disappeared", and I'm so very sorry about that. As I'm sure you know, in no way was I trying to make light of your loss. Did you have any luck with the Homeowner's Insurance like Bill R suggested?
I actually think every staff member Ginnie had was working that weekend, plus a couple of state troopers that they'd contracted out to....my god was it busy down there though!
To everyone out there, be careful...gear's expensive, and yeah, I probably hexed myself by saying "never" :roll:

Safe diving,

Rich

[DeWayne]

Memorial Day was actually a slow weekend for Ginnie; all I heard of getting stolen were James's two scooters and Linda's deco bottle. Such occurrences are far too common place at Ginnie and the primary reason that I refuse to go there. For the money they charge it would not be that hard to at least ensure our safety while topside on their property. I am waiting for some cave diver with the time and wherewithall to challenge Ginnie's utter disregard for these matters in court one day. The argument that they have someone watching just does not wash with me as we continue to hear about items sprouting legs and walking off. Perhaps they should attempt to actively enforce keeping the swimmers out of the divers' entrance area. I know that the swimmers bring in far more cash each day and that is their primary motive for being, but for what they charge to dive there they should be able to offer something more than "sorry to hear about your loss!" Until they take proactive steps to put a halt to this there will be those such as myself who refuse to go there (I have even gone as far as to tell instructors to forget about using the Devil's system as a training site with me unless they plan to boat in.) I don't think what we're asking for is any more out of line than what they charge to dive there; all we are asking for is to get what we paid for.


Dewayne, no offense but that's an idiotic post.....

I dive Ginnie on a daily basis, the staff there are extrememly friendly and extremely helpful, I'm good friends with most of them and I've never had anything stolen.

Of course I take personal responsiblity for my gear and don't whine about there being no security..like at Telford right :roll:.....if you just act sensibly and don't leave your stuff laying around for any Tom, Dick or Harry to walk off with then it won't get taken.

Do you leave your car unlocked with the keys in it and then whine when someone drives off with it? Ginnie makes their money off of campers (drunks) and tubers and they don't owe cave divers anything, I'm just thankful that we can access a premier system from their park.

I'm sorry you don't dive Ginnie, you're really missing out but it means it's less crowded for the rest of us!! And $300 a year to dive 24/7 is a pretty good deal in my book, with all the facilities, hot showers, deli food, dive shop on site etc!!

BTW I just came from the CDF social and they're already having an absolute blast down there....... :-D

Safe diving,

Rich

Think what you will Rich (aren't opinions grand), but too much gear just walks off there in the time it takes someone to turn around. It is a beautiful system yes, but IN MY OPINION they need to shift their emphasis a bit, at least if they want my money. If they can figure out how to moniitor who takes a scooter into the run, then why can't they apply that same watchful attitude into making sure that things don't walk off. I am not talking about gear that is left unattended over a period of time, I am referring to that stuff that goes missing in a matter of minutes. Ginnie is a commercial establishment, therefore I will hold them to a much higher expectation than I would hold for other places. Telford has never been that much of a problem, at least not for me; besides, I know when I go there that such a possibility exists so I take measures to prevent it. I guess you could say that I am taking my own measures to prevent the same thing at Ginnie by simply avoiding going there. It all boils down to my personal decision to support the places I feel deserve my support, and voice my opinion about the places I do not agree with-lets face it, my decision to blast Ford has little to do with getting hit by one and everything to do with Ford's stance to blame the driver rather than take corrective measures and put a stop to a known problem. Hope everyone has a good time at the social and takes the time to watch out for each other. We are getting packed ready to head down to Huntsville for a week of fun and excitement ourselves.

[Rich]

Think what you will Rich (aren't opinions grand), but too much gear just walks off there in the time it takes someone to turn around. It is a beautiful system yes, but IN MY OPINION they need to shift their emphasis a bit, at least if they want my money. If they can figure out how to moniitor who takes a scooter into the run, then why can't they apply that same watchful attitude into making sure that things don't walk off. I am not talking about gear that is left unattended over a period of time, I am referring to that stuff that goes missing in a matter of minutes. Ginnie is a commercial establishment, therefore I will hold them to a much higher expectation than I would hold for other places. Telford has never been that much of a problem, at least not for me; besides, I know when I go there that such a possibility exists so I take measures to prevent it. I guess you could say that I am taking my own measures to prevent the same thing at Ginnie by simply avoiding going there. It all boils down to my personal decision to support the places I feel deserve my support, and voice my opinion about the places I do not agree with-lets face it, my decision to blast Ford has little to do with getting hit by one and everything to do with Ford's stance to blame the driver rather than take corrective measures and put a stop to a known problem. Hope everyone has a good time at the social and takes the time to watch out for each other. We are getting packed ready to head down to Huntsville for a week of fun and excitement ourselves.

Got to agree with ya, opinions are great.. :-D

Trying to get anything changed at Ginnie with all the chiefs they have just isn't going to happen....d'ya hear they were getting Nitrox soon? :roll:

Hopefully I'll get my lazy ass up to the Millpond again one of these days and we'll get to dive up there. Now there's some awesome systems!!!

Anyways have yourself a great time in Alabama :-)

Safe diving,

Rich

[Rich]

Hate to say this but a friend of mine called my shop having just got his O2 bottle stolen from 35ft down in the Eye, keep an eye on your bottles people and take them into the cave!!.

Safe diving,

Rich

[HomoErectus]

Memorial Day was actually a slow weekend for Ginnie; .

WOW. Memorial Day was slow at Ginnie, that is defintly interesting to hear.

[curtschu]

They make great pains to ensure that Divers are wearing those wrist bands. Those are cheap and can be numbered. I had one at the Race Saturday night that was numbered. How about this? When you check in they give you X number of bands for gear you want to tag. IE: scooters, cylinders, lights, Then they provide folks that watch for tags If they see someone with gear that does not have a wristband they stop them and get the number off the tag. If the gear has no tag they take it to the office until the person can prove ownership. In the unlikely event someone that is credentialed as a diver steals someone's gear the numbers would not match IF you confront them. I hate to say this but Nascar does it right when it comes to keeping the masses under control. Dewayne makes the valid point that as a commercial operation they have a duty to protect their customers from each other. With someone posted at the points where we need to stage gear it would be much simpler for the “security” to check someone that is walking away with a scooter.
The next best thing would be a staging area just for diving that has gates like a ski lift that way only credentialed diver can enter.

[Tegg]

Hate to say this but a friend of mine called my shop having just got his O2 bottle stolen from 35ft down in the Eye, keep an eye on your bottles people and take them into the cave!!.

Safe diving,

Rich

Sometimes they aren't even safe there... :?

[Jim Wyatt]

When you check in they give you X number of bands for gear you want to tag. IE: scooters, cylinders, lights Its a great idea! But I wonder if the owners at Ginnie are all that concerned about keeping up with our gear??

I am just very glad that they even allow cave divers access to the caves. The liability is far greater than that for the tubers, campers & swimmers. Many places have been closed to diving because of liability and because divers can be a royal PITA.

Indeed it sucks that stuff is getting ripped off @ Ginnie and all the other dive spots but I am not sure placing the blame on Ginnie Springs owners & staff is right. I remember when Court Smith & Lewis Holzendorf had ALL their gear ripped off at Ginnie in about 1974....its an age old problem.

What responsibility does the staff @ Peacock & Little River accept for lost or stolen articles? AFAIK = 0.

Dewayne has the best solution to the problem for himself. He just chooses to stay away.

[curtschu]

I think the folks are looking to the owners because they charge a fee for the use of the facility regardless whether it is diving, tubing or camping and with that we as patrons have an expectation of security. It is the same as going to a concert or sporting event or State Park for that matter. All these places have a certain amount of security on staff. If they don’t wish to have the liability all they need to do is stop charging. (see previous discussion on sportsman’s act, PLEASE don’t highjack). Since that is really not an option they are faced with the reality of providing a service to a varied clientele.
I started an idea very off the cuff but this would allow us to help police the problem as we would be looking out for each other. The impact on them in the first phase (the wrist band and tags) would be fairly low and it always gives them the ability to say they are “doing something” about the problem. My next suggestion would involve an investment. Outsourcing the security to a private concern, this way there is a separation between the Ginnie staff and the Security staff. The bottom line IMHO is that Ginnie Springs Outdoors is a business catering to a fairly large populace and we just happen to be a fringy part of that group but just because we a on the fringe and don’t represent a Huge portion of the Annual revenue does not mean we are more or less entitled to adequate security.


Curt

[Cindy]

Only two things I can add here. 1. Mark your gear! Simple solution.
2. figure out who is selling this stuff and don't buy gear that is marked unless you know the owner.
Cindy :(

[Moonfuzzy]

I don't think what we're asking for is any more out of line than what they charge to dive there; all we are asking for is to get what we paid for.

Hmm... seems like we should apply this same principal to Jackson Blue. We pay them plenty of money to dive there, probably a large portion of annual revenue, and we don't even get to use the bathrooms!