Orange Grove is now opened to Open water divers

[Janet]

Park Manager Sherry McGowan informed Ranger West that open water diving is being permitted in Orange Grove Sink now. No lights or reels are allowed, even if you are cave certified doing an open water dive with a friend you are not allowed to have lights or reels on your person. Orange Grove is the only location for open water diving in PSSP. Happy diving!
Janet

[Tegg]

Were there complaints for the way it was?

Just wondering? :D

[normblitch]

Were there complaints for the way it was?

Just wondering? :D

Joe,

While I was not involved in the rule change, yes, there WERE some of us who wanted to take a squared-away OW or AOW'er there for OW stuff...if you love Fresh OW, it can be a wonderful dive...

Norm

[Dave Lizdas]

Thank you PSSP. I've got some squared-away open water buddies in mind. Mabe they'll catch the cave bug.

[Limestone Cowboy]

Park Manager Sherry McGowan informed Ranger West that open water diving is being permitted in Orange Grove Sink now. No lights or reels are allowed, even if you are cave certified doing an open water dive with a friend you are not allowed to have lights or reels on your person. Orange Grove is the only location for open water diving in PSSP. Happy diving!
Janet

Hi Janet,
This is great news IMO. Thanks for passing it on to us.
Drew

[anders]

Amusing ... guess we'll see quite a few "Open Water Divers Prohibited" t-shirts converted to oil-rags... :)

[CaptainSpeleo]

How are the rules going to be enforced? The park rangers can't watch it continually. I've made dives there on week days where I never saw a park ranger. My concern is how long it's going to be before a couple of openwater divers go diving there with sneaked-in lights and decide to go into the cave "just a little bit". We know what that eventually leads to. :(

[Dave Lizdas]

Another concern is visibility. OG is a pretty safe cavern when the vis is great.

Last weekend, I saw two OW folks swimmin from devil's eye to the ear, one with an itty bitty sneak light, the other, a glow stick. You can't search everyone's BC pockets. OW people will swim into the overhead. You cant stop 'em.

Should orange grove will be closed for OW diving when the vis isn't good in the cavern?

[Cindy]

I thought open water divers were allowed in there until a couple of years ago and that instructors used it as a training site? Am I thinking of manatee? If they were allowed in there was there a problem? I don't recall open water divers having problems lately. I think people are getting a lot more educated. I know several cave divers who would enjoy taking their families to Peacock with them. Not everyone enjoys overhead but are a lot of divers who do like to be where there family members are. I don't think it 's been a problem at Manatee. Knowing the state this was all looked at by a lot of people. I am happy it's open and would like to thank Janet for letting us know. Cindy Butler :)

[Wendy]

I thought open water divers were allowed in there until a couple of years ago and that instructors used it as a training site? Am I thinking of manatee? If they were allowed in there was there a problem? I don't recall open water divers having problems lately. I think people are getting a lot more educated. I know several cave divers who would enjoy taking their families to Peacock with them. Not everyone enjoys overhead but are a lot of divers who do like to be where there family members are. I don't think it 's been a problem at Manatee. Knowing the state this was all looked at by a lot of people. I am happy it's open and would like to thank Janet for letting us know. Cindy Butler :)

It used to be open to ow divers when I first started going up to cave country, but was changed to cavern and cave only a couple years ago. Not really sure why other than I had heard of some ow divers trying to follow cave teams into the cave, to the point where the cave divers had to turn around and abort the dive cuz if it.

[resolute]

This is great news!

I have found myself down there on occasion with my wife or others who are OW cert. and might be interested in a dive.

I will gladly leave the lights and reel in my vehicle if I can now properly complete a dive with them. Thanks to the park management.

AS for people "sneaking" into the cave, I think that if cave divers have OW divers try and follow them in or you see them inside (let's face it they aren't that hard to spot...) then turn around grab them by the tank valve and drag their little butts out to the entrance if they wont go out ahead of you - I highly doubt that they will follow you back again.. write them a wet note if you have to and tell them that you will be calling the Sheriff on them if they try it again (and you will be REALLY P.O.d if you have to get out of the water to make a phone call :evil: ), and wave goodbye to them and continue your cave dive. Once you are a few feet inside, you shouldn't have to worry about this scenario anyway - unless you meet some really foolish OW types (then do the same thing)

I wouldn't see this move by the park as anything but positive for everyone's benefit.

JB

[Dave]

AS for people "sneaking" into the cave, I think that if cave divers have OW divers try and follow them in or you see them inside (let's face it they aren't that hard to spot...) then turn around grab them by the tank valve and drag their little butts out to the entrance if they wont go out ahead of you - I highly doubt that they will follow you back again.. write them a wet note if you have to and tell them that you will be calling the Sheriff on them if they try it again (
Until the "little" 6'8" ex-marine O/W diver grabs YOUR valve and decides he didnt like your attitude then firmly places it in a new orifice........

dave

[resolute]

Until the "little" 6'8" ex-marine O/W diver grabs YOUR valve and decides he didnt like your attitude then firmly places it in a new orifice........

dave

For someone that stubborn or foolhardy I'd just call/abort the dive, return to the surface (hopefully he'd follow - if not, oh well) - go to my phone and call the sheriff or the park law enforcement- let them deal with him and his "attitude" (after all, that's what they get paid to do)... I'll just be a willing witness as to what happened if necessary... Guess some days just aren't meant for diving for various reasons....

Seriously, this place was available as a good OW dive site for years, and I personally recall having many wonderful OW dives in OG. Of course, I knew that the cave was stricitly off limits, respected that fact and never had any problems.

(and I also knew if I was caught with a light, I would have one of more of these things happen: 1- be thrown out of the park, 2- have my gear confiscated, 3- be fined or 4 - go to jail (just like it should be..) - and jail in Suwanee County dosen't seem like it would be too fun :-D

JB

[amphipod06]

Until the "little" 6'8" ex-marine O/W diver grabs YOUR valve and decides he didnt like your attitude then firmly places it in a new orifice........

dave

For someone that stubborn or foolhardy I'd just call/abort the dive, return to the surface (hopefully he'd follow - if not, oh well) - go to my phone and call the sheriff or the park law enforcement- let them deal with him and his "attitude" (after all, that's what they get paid to do)... I'll just be a willing witness as to what happened if necessary... Guess some days just aren't meant for diving for various reasons....

Seriously, this place was available as a good OW dive site for years, and I personally recall having many wonderful OW dives in OG. Of course, I knew that the cave was stricitly off limits, respected that fact and never had any problems.

(and I also knew if I was caught with a light, I would have one of more of these things happen: 1- be thrown out of the park, 2- have my gear confiscated, 3- be fined or 4 - go to jail (just like it should be..) - and jail in Suwanee County dosen't seem like it would be too fun :-D

JB

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

[resolute]

[Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

Not sure..... maybe its an old wives tale.... but it's what was being passed around the rumor mill back when I was an OW type hanging around Peacock.. but I actually do believe that they can levy some kind of penalty on you for improperly accessing the springs (just like solo diving improperly there)... anyone in autho-ri-TAY care to comment?? :D

JB

[Tegg]

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

I have personally seen Janet throw someone out for solo diving, more then once. She watches the park like a hawk from what I have seen, and I'm thankful for it. :-D

[rblackburn]

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

I saw someone kicked out of the park for solo diving last year. The ranger said if law enforcement had gotten there before they left gear would have been confiscated...

[amphipod06]

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

I saw someone kicked out of the park for solo diving last year. The ranger said if law enforcement had gotten there before they left gear would have been confiscated...

Although I have seen Janet admonish and ultimately sell an annual pass (in lieu of kicking their sorry bottom out of the park) to several solo divers I don't think anyone has suffered any lasting consequences to the breaking of rules.
It is not difficult to keep an eye on trained cave divers (not that she really needs to since the vast majority have good judgement and follow the rules, support the park and are self policing), OW divers may be more difficult (although they sure stick out with all the colorful gear...) to police and keep out of places they shouldn't be.
The comment was not meant to be a criticism of Janet's ability to police and enforce the rules, rather a comment on the fact that nothing can really be done unless law enforcement personnel are present and as you mentioned, the offending diver usually takes their leave prior to that occurring.
Ok, back to lurk. Dive safe and come back to tell the story.

Celia

[DeWayne]

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time someone was:
1- thrown out of the park, 2- have their gear confiscated, 3- fined or 4 - went to jail
for breaking the rules?

Celia

I saw someone kicked out of the park for solo diving last year. The ranger said if law enforcement had gotten there before they left gear would have been confiscated...

If Gabry is reading this I bet he is breathing a big sigh of relief that it was not the same ranger who caught him solo on his YBOD last year :oops: He just wrote his name down to be reported, not sure who it was being reported to though. Heard mention this year of a possible ban if one gets caught more than once.