Door Handles or Waist D-Rings for Sidemount..?

[steve626508]

Hi everyone, just thought I would post an interesting sidemount equipment question and see what the general thoughts are on it...

Is using a butt plate and "door handles" or "rails" getting more and more phased out and instead everyone is now moving towards using waist d-rings for the rear cylinder attachment..?

I personally find that when I clip the rear of the cylinders to the butt plate "door handles", I can not keep the cylinders trimmed as they become more buoyant, especially when sidemounting aluminum cylinders. For me the waist d-rings work great making the door handles just a place to clip accessories and not the cylinders...

Will we see a move in what equipment manufactures start to bring out..?

[SuPrBuGmAn]

With tanks that get butt light as they empty... I use both. Door handles when they are full, and waist Drings as they start to get floaty in the ass.

[FW]

I have always used waist D-rings. I tried the "door handles" but I didn't like them. FWIW, I have dived sidemount since 1977.

[steve626508]

I have always used waist D-rings. I tried the "door handles" but I didn't like them. FWIW, I have dived sidemount since 1977.

Can I ask what exactly you did not like and what problems you had..?

I have found that the cylinders swing away from your sides when on the "door handles" especially when using a standard bungee that comes with some of the commercial sidemount systems on the market.

Rob (RN) can you please share your thoughts on this topic..?

[stairman]

I use the door handles and find the bottles fit very snug to my sides. For the top connection I use double enders on hog rings along with bungees and have no sagging or outswing of bottles but all that didnt come about overnight of course.

[Spd 135]

I have the old style butt-plate with 2 d-rings on each side. I don't have a problem with that instead of the rails. I actually like it because I see it as a bit more stable because it doesn't allow the bottles to slide. But then, if a bottle moves, a bit, is it REALLY a big deal? I can adjust my bottles if I need to in a more static manner. I also have a waist d-ring on each side and I can use those as well. I think it has more to do with getting your bottles right than the attachment point, ie; the length of static cord and type of clip, and where you place the cam band or hose clamp. I am in the middle range of s/m experience. I am not new, but I am nowhere near guys like Kelly J and RobN, Edd and Forrest. I can tell you that, from my experience, I think too many people worry about having a perfect rig, instead of an adequate rig. The more you dive your rig, and the more you dive with different sidemount people, the better it will get. And, it may not be about change, just minor tweaks along the way. (Russell, please forgive the And ;-))

[CaveBuddy95]

I have'nt had the opportunity to try the handles, was lucky enough to discover sm with the Razor :) but from what I hear and see would it be correct to say that actually US built rigs have the handles due to steel tanks? Are the handles actually more apropriate for steel tanks than Als?

I've seen the set-up mentioned by Spd135, added D-ring on the side of butt plate. It was done to a diver taking cave course here in Mex. He had a brand new Dilo harness and the instructor took handles off and tie-wrapped 2 D-rings... Personal views I guess ;)

[Kelly Jessop]

I have been a fan of side attachment at the hip,and not rails. I tried rails,and hated the lack of control of the tank from bouyancy. I created a way of fixating carrbiners to the tank

.31403141

[RN]

I like the door handles for a few different reasons. First, I almost never dive aluminum cylinders, so moving the clips to waist mounted d-rings isn't an issue. Steel cylinders stay heavy enough throughout most dives. The reason I like the door handles is they are fixed so they are easier to clip the cylinders back onto them. Simply reach back and push the butterfly clip onto the handle. While some people like a more fixed location of the cylinders, I like the tanks having more maneuverability. It makes it easier for me to get through really tight passage without having to remove the cylinders. The static cord from my cylinder straps to the clip is about 1.5 inches long. Granted, I could still have some maneuverability with d-rings, but I think it would be limited. That's the one of the great things about sidemount. There are so many ways to approach it. You simply need to try out the different methods and adopt what works best for the diving that you do. Very few of my students come out of my sidemount classes with their gear exactly like mine. And I don't want them to just mirror me. I want them to try out different things and then leave the class wanting to keep experimenting until they find something that works for them. Then 6 months later they'll change again. ;)

[Slüdge]

That's the one of the great things about sidemount. There are so many ways to approach it. You simply need to try out the different methods and adopt what works best for the diving that you do.

Yeah, I feel the same way about backmount...

[CaveBuddy95]

And it's ok to feel like this! ;)

[Kelly Jessop]

Granted, I could still have some maneuverability with d-rings, but I think it would be limited.

Rob,you might be surprised at how much maneuverability you have with having a fixed placement at the side of the hip. By having no leash length,and a fixed point of attachment I avoid all the pitfalls that come with rails,and bouyany changes with any type cylinder-I never have to tinker because a tank is low on pressure and is floating.

[FW]

Can I ask what exactly you did not like and what problems you had..?

I have found that the cylinders swing away from your sides when on the "door handles" especially when using a standard bungee that comes with some of the commercial sidemount systems on the market...
I had that problem with AL tanks too, but I also do a lot of sump diving, and walking through the cave with a "beaver tail" is a PITA.

[Shocky]

Well, I'm new to sidemount not because I want to go in small holes but I'm older and tired of humping back mount. I took my 15 year old Transpac, removed the pad, cut back the four web atachjments for single tank, moved the Rec wings inside with two bolts, put the offset fixed "D" rings on the 2" web belt at the hip, and attached bungees at the top rings on the front and back. My 85's have chokers with double ended snaps that attach directly to the bungee cord. Bottom of the tank has SS strap with D ring, short length of 100lb cord and SS suicide clips. I know, bad clips, but I can hook to my D ring without dislocating my shoulder! Seems to work fine, most of the hardware is Dive Rite, pictures available.
John

[RN]

Rob,you might be surprised at how much maneuverability you have with having a fixed placement at the side of the hip. By having no leash length,and a fixed point of attachment I avoid all the pitfalls that come with rails,and bouyany changes with any type cylinder-I never have to tinker because a tank is low on pressure and is floating.

I'll have to try it sometime. I just haven't had the issue with buoyancy changes. When I dive ALs, I put trim weights on them. The one time I had an issue was when I filled a set of Faber 95s with trimix. By the end of the dive, not only were the tanks light, but so was I!

[Kelly Jessop]

I'll have to try it sometime. I just haven't had the issue with buoyancy changes. When I dive ALs, I put trim weights on them. The one time I had an issue was when I filled a set of Faber 95s with trimix. By the end of the dive, not only were the tanks light, but so was I!

I like having to rigid fixed points that mate at my hip region. No matter what tank,gas etc,I don't have an issue. I have a system for variable weight that build into the harness,but well hidden,that I utilize with heavy dry suit underwear,and high % He etc.

[saxplayer1004]

that's what you get for using Faber instead of PST :-P

[RN]

The Fabers are so much nicer with nitrox, easier to control. Never have a problem with them as long as there's no helium in there. :D

[saxplayer1004]

My 95's are Fabers. Just picking on you. When I use trimix I always use my PST 120's. Still sink a drysuit.

[Tegg]

I have found that I tend to be more comfortable with the steel tanks clipping further down and when diving with the AL80s they seem fine on the waist. I think it has a lot to do with the buoyancy characteristic of the tank and how it rides in relation to your body.

[aainslie]

Two D rings - one set as close to the back as possible given the BC (in fact with some BC's then can be UNDER the BC and really close to the centre of one's back), and one set in a more conventional forward position. Go into the system on the back D rings and transition to the front D rings as the tanks begin to float if the tanks are aluminium. This isn't necessary with steels - they just stay at the back. Always worked for me.

On a similar vein - place full stages above the main tanks on the way in and empty ones below on the way out.

I've always hated door handles. They start catching onto all sorts of stuff when the cave gets small.