Razor Harness

[scoupland]

Anybody dive with Steve Bogaert's Razor harness? Would love a report. It's very clean and streamlined but has no built in wings. He uses a "bat wing" that he devised but I'm not sure it would give enough bouyancy. They only dive AL 80's in MX and most of the cave systems are relatively shallow (30'-40'). You can see his harness on his website if you are interested: www.gosidemount.com.

[icestac]

There are a few reports of people who have dove them -- a number asking questions after diving them. Just do a search for razor.

Cheers,
Jeff

[scoupland]

Lesson learned--do a search before starting a thread. Thanks.

[Chris Armstrong]

Anybody dive with Steve Bogaert's Razor harness? Would love a report. It's very clean and streamlined but has no built in wings. He uses a "bat wing" that he devised but I'm not sure it would give enough bouyancy. They only dive AL 80's in MX and most of the cave systems are relatively shallow (30'-40'). You can see his harness on his website if you are interested: www.gosidemount.com. (http://www.gosidemount.com.)

I agree with you about the bat-wing. It's actually a camel-pak hydration type object, it provides a few lb's of lift, which as you say is all you need in MX when diving a wetsuit with ally-80's - you couldn't attach 104's to it, it would just sink away and not provide the buoyancy requirements to float the cylinders.

The razor was designed for a purpose and it meets it, you would need a larger buoyancy source so use it with the big steels we use. If you could get a 40-55 lb buoyancy source in there then its cracked, but then you're back at the nomad really which is designed for the FL cave divers with a pair of 104's attached and isn't designed for the same purpose as the razor .....

So really after a convoluted answer, if you are diving wet, with ally-80's (granted as many as you want) razor is a perfect system, otherwise stick to the more conventional SM harnesses providing the 40-50 lbs of lift required for the SM 104's.

Best Wishes,

Chris

[LiteHedded]

I agree with you about the bat-wing. It's actually a camel-pak hydration type object, it provides a few lb's of lift, which as you say is all you need in MX when diving a wetsuit with ally-80's - you couldn't attach 104's to it, it would just sink away and not provide the buoyancy requirements to float the cylinders.

The razor was designed for a purpose and it meets it, you would need a larger buoyancy source so use it with the big steels we use. If you could get a 40-55 lb buoyancy source in there then its cracked, but then you're back at the nomad really which is designed for the FL cave divers with a pair of 104's attached and isn't designed for the same purpose as the razor .....

So really after a convoluted answer, if you are diving wet, with ally-80's (granted as many as you want) razor is a perfect system, otherwise stick to the more conventional SM harnesses providing the 40-50 lbs of lift required for the SM 104's.

Best Wishes,

Chris
isn't andrew ainsle diving big steels with it?

[Chris Armstrong]

isn't andrew ainsle diving big steels with it?


I dunno - never heard of him

I suppose if you used a drysuit to provide the buoyancy and didn't use the wing that would work.

My impression was that the razor is more of a warm-water rig for using ally's though - correct me if I'm wrong.

[fixxervi6]

isn't andrew ainsle diving big steels with it?

I don't think he is using a camel back BC on it, I think he is using a regular wing, he is on the board shoot him a PM

[LiteHedded]

I dunno - never heard of him

I suppose if you used a drysuit to provide the buoyancy and didn't use the wing that would work.

My impression was that the razor is more of a warm-water rig for using ally's though - correct me if I'm wrong.

my impression as well but I'm pretty sure andrew is doing some substantial dives with it in florida caves. not sure what he's using for lift outside of a drysuit. maybe he will chime in

[scoupland]

My understanding from Steve Bogaerts is that you can add a wing to the Rzor if lift is needed. He told me I could pull the wings off my Nomad and put them on the Razor. At that point I'm not sure there would be that much difference between them. I think the Razor with wings would be more streamlined than the Nomad and if that is what one is after, then maybe it would be worth it. I read some previous threads on the Razor and those that are diving with it are very positive about it.

[Tegg]

My understanding from Steve Bogaerts is that you can add a wing to the Rzor if lift is needed. He told me I could pull the wings off my Nomad and put them on the Razor. At that point I'm not sure there would be that much difference between them. I think the Razor with wings would be more streamlined than the Nomad and if that is what one is after, then maybe it would be worth it. I read some previous threads on the Razor and those that are diving with it are very positive about it.

If someone just throws a wing under the razor they will have pretty bad taco wing....

[NorthWoodsDiver]

If someone just throws a wing under the razor they will have pretty bad taco wing....

It wouldn't take much effort or money to solve that. Use the nomad wing as an example, with it's webbing loops for the shoulder straps and some belt slides sewn in for the waist strap to run through. That's a simple mod that anyone who can sew could do for the cost of 12" of webbing and 2 belt slides.

One could install some grommets and use bungee too or even make a sing that's held on with bolt snaps or.... the options are limitless.

[aainslie]

Sorry not to come in earlier - I've been away from the internet (makes for a nice break!!)

I use a Razor, with a modified wing from Tobin (deepseasupply.com) designed for something called "monkey diving". It has about 15 lbs lift. I also use a drysuit. The combination os sufficient for me to dive with 2x104's and up to 5 stages comfortably, in a range from super full to super empty.

When Steve needs a bit of buoyancy he uses a 4L Camelback hydration unit tied in carefully to prevent tacoing. I did this for a while using an MSR 4L bladder, but I prefer Tobin's unit. The BI advantage of using hydration packs is they cost a tenth of the price.

Typically, I fully inflate the bladder at depth (most of these units require oral inflation so it pays not to keep fiddling iwth them) and then fully deflate it at my turnpoint. I make up the difference and fine tune using my drysuit.

For those saying you shouldn't depend on your drysuit for buoyancy, I'd ask why. I've had a few floods, and every time there's SOMEWHERE in the suit that you can put a bubble of gas to float you out. Unless ALL the back seams fail simultaneously (a little unlikely) your drysuit is fine for primary buoyancy. Just know how to move the "bubble" around.

It's an awesome system in small places.

[WJH]

It wouldn't take much effort or money to solve that. Use the nomad wing as an example, with it's webbing loops for the shoulder straps and some belt slides sewn in for the waist strap to run through. That's a simple mod that anyone who can sew could do for the cost of 12" of webbing and 2 belt slides.

One could install some grommets and use bungee too or even make a sing that's held on with bolt snaps or.... the options are limitless.

A lot of work to go to to make it almost as functional as a nomad, when you could just buy a nomad and be ready to dive!

WJH

[Chris Armstrong]

Sorry not to come in earlier - I've been away from the internet (makes for a nice break!!)

I use a Razor, with a modified wing from Tobin (deepseasupply.com) designed for something called "monkey diving". It has about 15 lbs lift. I also use a drysuit. The combination os sufficient for me to dive with 2x104's and up to 5 stages comfortably, in a range from super full to super empty.

I'm interested in getting into SM - would you recommend the Razor as a harness?

Can Tobin do more of these "modifications"? If he can i'd be very interested in getting the razor modded with the extra buoyancy wing - whats the total cost of buying all the bits (harness & new wing).

Regards,

Chris

[FW]

I'm interested in getting into SM - would you recommend the Razor as a harness?

Can Tobin do more of these "modifications"? If he can i'd be very interested in getting the razor modded with the extra buoyancy wing - whats the total cost of buying all the bits (harness & new wing).

Regards,

Chris

Uh Chris, sidemount was invented in England. Talk to Martyn Farr. He makes a harness similar to the Razor, and you wouldn't have to pay import duty. http://www.farrworld.co.uk/acatalog/equipment.html

[aainslie]

Martyn's harness isn't that similar. it's a great harness, but not the same.

I use:

- The Nomad with my rebreather (SM ballout)
- Martyn's in the sea (it has really heavy duty webbing I like around wrecks)
- Steve's for really tight spaces.

So... it depends on the job being done.