How a cave diver filmed his own death

[Dwain]

1. http://www.theage.com.au/news/National/How-a-cave-diver-filmed-his-own-death/2005/01/14/1105582714674.html?oneclick=true (this link had you log in if you wish, I have also added the article & image below)

2. http://capeargus.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2372385

3. http://www.sabcnews.com/south_africa/general/0,2172,95464,00.html


If you look at the shirt (in first link) that the diver is wearing you may recognize it.

220 meter = 721.7847769 feet
250 meter = 820.2099738 feet
271 meter = 889.1076115 feet
http://www.theage.com.au/ffxmedia/2005/01/14/15divegraphic.jpg

I can't access the site without registering, and I'm tired of giving out my e-mail address. How about telling us what shirt he was wearing?

Russell

[Dwain]

How a cave diver filmed his own death
By Sahm Venter
Age Correspondent
Johannesburg
January 15, 2005

Dave Shaw before his last dive
Photo:

http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2005/01/14/15n_shaw_narrowweb__200x256.jpg
Related
Deadly descent
Dave Shaw took only 10 minutes to descend 271 metres to the bottom of the Boesmansgat Cave, half the time planned, to Deon Dreyer's skeleton.

Video footage shot by Mr Shaw indicates that about 25 minutes after the world-record diver entered the freshwater cave last Sunday to recover the decade-old remains of Mr Dreyer, 20, Mr Shaw also was dead.

In a bizarre twist, the Australian airline pilot's body was unexpectedly pulled to the surface on Thursday attached to Mr Dreyer's. Mr Shaw had became tangled in the nylon line he had attached to Mr Dreyer's remains.

Divers retrieving equipment left behind by Mr Shaw found the bodies 20 metres beneath the surface. When the line attached to Mr Dreyer was pulled, both bodies came up.

While an autopsy has yet to be completed, the video camera specially designed for the recovery mission, and worn on Mr Shaw's helmet, has provided a record of his last minutes alive.

Boesmansgat Cave, in South Africa's Northern Cape province, is the world's third-deepest freshwater cave. In October, Mr Shaw, 50, a Hong Kong-based pilot, became the only person to have dived 271 metres with the help of rebreather apparatus, which enables divers to recycle air.

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AdvertisementFrom the moment he emerged from Boesmansgat Cave, though, Mr Shaw's achievement was overshadowed by his discovery. Even during that first dive, the Australian had tried to recover the remains, still clad in a wetsuit and diving gear. But the gas tanks were embedded in mud. Mr Shaw immediately began planning to bring to the surface the remains of Deon Dreyer, who had drowned on December 17, 1994.

Mr Shaw discussed his find with Dreyer's father, Theo. "I promised to do my best to bring him to the surface but reminded him . . . there was no guarantee of success," he said.

With a team of trusted divers, he began planning the operation. A team of eight technical divers and two police divers was to pass Mr Dreyer's body to the surface.

On the morning of January 2, Mr Shaw's flight landed in Johannesburg just hours after he had said goodbye to his Melbourne-born wife, Ann, at their Hong Kong home.

Mr Shaw spent the night at the home of Don Shirley, a technical diving instructor. Then they drove to the Mount Carmel game farm of Andries and Debbie Van Zyl, where the cave is situated.

For the next two days, Mr Shaw and his team worked in sweltering heat, clambering up and down a 70 metre rocky incline to and from the cave's entrance as they put in place safety measures.

While he chatted almost every day to Mr Dreyer's parents - who were on site - Mr Shaw was clear there was no place for emotion. His concern was to get the technical aspects right.

At a private team discussion on Friday night Mr Shaw and Mr Shirley, who would dive the deepest, announced that no one should risk their lives for them. If they died, no one was to try to recover their bodies. It was too dangerous.

Just before dinner, Mr Shaw slipped fellow diver Derek Hughes a telephone number for a family friend and Anglican priest, the Reverend Michael Vickers, in Hong Kong, who had agreed to be the bad news contact.

The team of 11 technical divers rose before the sun and drove for 20 minutes along a nine kilometre gravel road to the cave where five police divers, paramedics and a doctor were waiting.

At the five-square-metre pool, which is the entrance to the caves below, Mr Shaw pulled on his gear, which included a blue helmet with a video camera on the front to record his mission for a planned documentary. He drank some mineral water, bade his colleagues farewell and began descending to 270 metres. It was 6.15am.

At 6.28am, Mr Shirley followed, expecting that Mr Shaw would have cut Mr Dreyer from his tanks, placed his remains in a body bag and started his ascent.

The clear waters revealed only the faintest pinpricks of Mr Shaw's lights and no bubbles to indicate he was on his way up. He was not waving his lights to show he was in trouble. So Mr Shirley continued down to 250 metres to look for him.

At around 20 metres from where Shaw's lights were, the computers controlling Mr Shirley's breathing equipment "cracked and imploded". He had to come up to save himself.

About 90 minutes into the operation that was supposed to have yielded a body bag in 80 minutes, support diver Peter Herbst had not found Mr Shirley at the arranged 80 metre mark and he dropped another 40 metres, where he received an ominous message written on a slate: "Dave's not coming back."

Just under four hours after the dive had begun, Derek Hughes phoned Mr Vickers, who waited an hour before visiting Mrs Shaw with the news of her husband's death. Mrs Shaw asked that her husband's body not be retrieved, but in the end it surfaced.

[Mart]

1. http://www.theage.com.au/news/National/How-a-cave-diver-filmed-his-own-death/2005/01/14/1105582714674.html?oneclick=true (this link had you log in if you wish, I have also added the article & image below)

2. http://capeargus.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2372385

3. http://www.sabcnews.com/south_africa/general/0,2172,95464,00.html


If you look at the shirt (in first link) that the diver is wearing you may recognize it.

220 meter = 721.7847769 feet
250 meter = 820.2099738 feet
271 meter = 889.1076115 feet


http://www.exn.ca/video/?video=exn20050127-blackwater.asx

[NitroxWarrior]

I didnt know that cave was that big, sounds lke he died of c02 build up[/i]

[Mart]

EDIT :Link Removed. If you wish to get the link, please PM MART

While I respect everyone's wishes to view whatever they want it doesn't mean you get to view it here.

Jay

[Dwain]

Thanks for the video link... I didn't realize it was out there.

[Mart]

Thanks for the video link... I didn't realize it was out there.

The link to the complete video is dead..........

[JDostal]

Wow...that video is just...it's very sad :(

[Deep-Thief]

Thanks to all for the posts and links. If anyone knows where to find the complete video please post it. Thanks again to all.

[Cindy]

Why does this strike me as so sad and gross? I can understand wanting to see the graph to understand the accident but a video? Oh, I know, lets see if we can get you all the photos by the guy that died in Mexico too! What's next? Cave diving snuff films?

[Mart]

Why does this strike me as so sad and gross? I can understand wanting to see the graph to understand the accident but a video? Oh, I know, lets see if we can get you all the photos by the guy that died in Mexico too! What's next? Cave diving snuff films?

Hi Cindy, you are missing the point.
We are taking risks every dive, thats why we want to figure out what went wrong with these divers.
It is called accident analysis, Sheck Exley was the first diver to do this.

Mart

[Cindy]

First, I can say I don't agree with the accident analysis that has been going on in the web forums. Too many people who don't know what is going on have been slandering good people they don't know, guessing and in general running everything about cave diving down that doesn't go along with THEIR view of what cave diving is 'all about'. Accident analysis has nothing to do with video's or photos of dead divers. You all had the analysis with graphs. Not stopping there but having to see the actual death of a human being in a cave is just not right. I don't care what spin you want to put on it.

Throwing the name Sheck Exley doesn't impress me. He was a great cave diver. He also died in a cave. Did you want video of that too?

[BobK]

Why does this strike me as so sad and gross? I can understand wanting to see the graph to understand the accident but a video? Oh, I know, lets see if we can get you all the photos by the guy that died in Mexico too! What's next? Cave diving snuff films?

Same thing as everyone slowing down to look when they drive past a car wreck. There seems to be some sort of fascination with viewing other people's troubles and disasters, quite apart from any "analysis" that is supposed to be going on. :(

[FW]

Hi Cindy, you are missing the point.
We are taking risks every dive, thats why we want to figure out what went wrong with these divers.
It is called accident analysis, Sheck Exley was the first diver to do this.

Mart

Actually she isn't missing the point. Many of the rest of you are.

When Sheck did accident analysis, it was way after the fact, and very statistical in nature. He only took the facts from old reports. He never mentioned any names, or placed any blame.

The problem today is many want "instant analysis". That leads to upsetting survivors, and often placing blame.

We *all* need to let an accident "cool off" before we start analyzing it. We need to stick to facts, and not speculate. And above all, we need to leave out the *names*.

[JDostal]

This video wasn't "straight from the camera to the computer". This was a discovery channel interview with the surviving surface diver, and small clips from the last dive.

Please be sure to let the people watching on their TV's at home that they are morbid as well.

[Mart]

This video wasn't "straight from the camera to the computer". This was a discovery channel interview with the surviving surface diver, and small clips from the last dive.

Please be sure to let the people watching on their TV's at home that they are morbid as well.

Thank You!!!!!

[DeWayne]

Hi Cindy, you are missing the point.
We are taking risks every dive, thats why we want to figure out what went wrong with these divers.
It is called accident analysis, Sheck Exley was the first diver to do this.

Mart

Actually she isn't missing the point. Many of the rest of you are.

When Sheck did accident analysis, it was way after the fact, and very statistical in nature. He only took the facts from old reports. He never mentioned any names, or placed any blame.

The problem today is many want "instant analysis". That leads to upsetting survivors, and often placing blame.

We *all* need to let an accident "cool off" before we start analyzing it. We need to stick to facts, and not speculate. And above all, we need to leave out the *names*.

Thanks for your most excellent insight on this topic FW. I'm with Cindy on this one. When I first heard about the existence of such video footage, I prayed that it would be used wisely by those with the skill and know how to interpret what can be seen, not blasted across the internet so everyone with an opinion can stroke their ego by offering their not so expert commentary on what happened. I've seen rubber neckers cause a lot more accidents than I have ever seen them help with.

[Deep-Thief]

Hi Cindy, you are missing the point.
We are taking risks every dive, thats why we want to figure out what went wrong with these divers.
It is called accident analysis, Sheck Exley was the first diver to do this.

Mart

Actually she isn't missing the point. Many of the rest of you are.

When Sheck did accident analysis, it was way after the fact, and very statistical in nature. He only took the facts from old reports. He never mentioned any names, or placed any blame.

The problem today is many want "instant analysis". That leads to upsetting survivors, and often placing blame.

We *all* need to let an accident "cool off" before we start analyzing it. We need to stick to facts, and not speculate. And above all, we need to leave out the *names*.

Thanks for your most excellent insight on this topic FW. I'm with Cindy on this one. When I first heard about the existence of such video footage, I prayed that it would be used wisely by those with the skill and know how to interpret what can be seen, not blasted across the internet so everyone with an opinion can jay their ego by offering their not so expert commentary on what happened. I've seen rubber neckers cause a lot more accidents than I have ever seen them help with.

Well... I guess I stirred the pot. Accident analysis would be the correct reason for me wanting to see the complete video(Not that I need to justify my reasons to anyone but myself). If you don't like it or don't want to see it, then don't. No one said you had to watch it. Its called self censorship, if you don't like whats on, change the channel. Any one thats complaining about this, did you click on the link and watch that footage? If you did then you are just as bad as I.

FW- I guess you haven't read your copy in a while(I am assuming you do have a copy) of A Blueprint For Survival by Sheck Exley. Try opening it and reading. It gives names, dates, places, and YES it does place blame. I am not trying to upset any relatives of Mr. Shaws. I simply want to see for myself what happened and not rely on someone elses account of it. His death would be for nothing if we didn't learn from it and try to not make the same mistakes he did. Will I be diving to 870ft. on a rebreather, NO, does that mean I can't learn anything, NO.

[FW]

FW- I guess you haven't read your copy in a while(I am assuming you do have a copy) of A Blueprint For Survival by Sheck Exley. Try opening it and reading. It gives names, dates, places, and YES it does place blame. .

Maybe you need to re-read the Forward in Blueprint for Survival. Sheck clearly states that the names have been changed, and the accidents were used to illustrate a point.

I am not questioning the validity of accident analysis, nor of the movie, just the need for instant analysis.

Sheck was a math teacher, and studied the accidents statistically. He was looking for a "common denominator", but instead found three. The others were added later as more data became available.

FWIW, I have several copies of Basic Cave Diving, and one signed by Sheck, saying "Forrest, Thanks for all your help in making this book a reality, and cave diving a safer activity".

[Cindy]

What I have been reading post on many of the web sites and what is represented by viewing the video of a man dying in a cave has nothing to do with accident analysis. I'll explain as best I can what I feel is going on. I have worked Emergency and ICU's for 24 years. On an average I see one or two human beings die from all kinds of things each and every week, some weeks more. I see how families and people react to death. I am not a Sociologist, psychologist and proctologist, but I know a lot of cave divers that need all three. I am a human who has been dealing with this stuff for a long time. What I have seen posted and how many are reacting to the accidents this year has nothing to do with cave diving and everything to do with fear. By taking each incident apart many seem to find some sort of comfort in saying to themselves that 'this will never happen to me' because I was trained by Joe Blow, I never break the 'rules', I don't do rebreathers, etc etc. By running these dead divers down and picking at their dive buddies it seems to be lending many some sick sense of power over death. It has nothing to do with accident analysis and has everything to do with FEAR. What has been happening on the internet is not a good thing or in any way constructive, no real changes are going to take place. It's a death ritual that has got to stop! We are tearing down good people, destroying all sence of community that we have as cave divers. Many of these posts are done by people who have very little experience (like someone who told Forrest to re-read Sheck's book, please, the man lived it with him, are you that new?) people who don't dive enough (you will at some point bend or break all the rules if you dive long enough, intentionally or not, I will explain this more) or people who have an agenda to promote their agency, their training and their need for money. It's simply got to stop. We have got to have some decency if we ever want this sport to be accepted by mainstream society. All this is proving is what a fractured bunch of ego nuts we are becoming. Which is exacly what most people think cave divers are!

Now to clarify some of my thoughts for those who care to read them. To quote poor Sheck "if you cave dive long enough you or someone you know will die in a cave". To quote Hal Watts, "human beings are not meant to fly in the air or swim in water filled caves, as long as they insist on doing both there will be accidents and people will occassionally die". So let me be clear on this. YOU CAN DIE IN A WATER FILLED CAVE. You can do everything right and DIE IN A WATER FILLED CAVE. Someone who is on deco in front of you can play on the cavern roof and the sand will block your way out, someone can drive up a car too close to the air pump and the filter will put just a little too much carbon monoxide in your air, someone will mess with your markers, etc. You can reduce risk by training, you can reduce risk with experience but you cannot negate it! Think about it, how many times have you gotten confused driving your car around, ran through a red light because your attention was on something else? We do things like that all the time and get away with it because we have air, time and skill. You have skill, dive buddies and luck in a cave, you don't have air and you don't have time. That is what is REAL about accidents. If you really want to learn something from the deaths lately I have some things that you can learn and do that I see mature adults do in responce to tragic death.

A. Accept that you can "DIE IN A WATER FILLED CAVE" and that others can too. If you can't accept that then please take up ping pong. Be responsable for yourself.

B. Take care of your family, make sure you have a will, get insurance. Make sure that if you make a mistake doing what for most of us is a hobby that your family will not have to suffer .(ie your wife loose the house, your kids not be able to go to college) Tell them you love them now and treat them well now. You won't have to spend those last minutes writing notes to them and can spend that time getting your butt out of the cave.

C. Make peace with your maker, higher power or self. What ever that means to you. People who can do that don't face panic at that last moment of life. Live your life with some gratitude and hope, it will have a lot more meaning.

We have a fantastic sport. We are so fortunate to be able to explore our caves. There are so many fantastic things that we can share with each other. Please don't let the internet ruin what we have good in cave diving. We are a community, I want us to remain one. That means being realistic adults, learning, forgiving and moving on when the time comes. Leave accident analysis to experts. Have some class and kindness toward your fellow divers. Don't continue this behavior of tearing each other apart and down. Because truly what goes around can come around and next week it could be your family watching a video of you dying in a cave on the internet.

[Bob]

Thats powerfull stuff, and well said.

[DeWayne]

Well said Cindy.

[Deep-Thief]

FW- I guess you haven't read your copy in a while(I am assuming you do have a copy) of A Blueprint For Survival by Sheck Exley. Try opening it and reading. It gives names, dates, places, and YES it does place blame. .

Maybe you need to re-read the Forward in Blueprint for Survival. Sheck clearly states that the names have been changed, and the accidents were used to illustrate a point.

".

FW - I am sorry, names have been changed. Please accept my appology.

[Deep-Thief]

Many of these posts are done by people who have very little experience (like someone who told Forrest to re-read Sheck's book, please, the man lived it with him, are you that new?) .

I didn't realize that a requirement of being a cave diver was knowing who FW is. How am I supposed to know. I am New to this forum, not new to diving.

[John L.]

Don't let you mouth write a check your ass can't cash.

[Deep-Thief]

My ass can cash ANY check my mouth writes. I am man enough to admit when I am wrong. Thank god I am not arrogant enough to think that I must know who someone with the initials FW is and that I can't be an experienced cave diver without knowing. No disrespect to FW(whoever you are) is intended or implied.

[Cindy]

Sir, I am very sorry I posted that comment about your post to Forrest. I am a poor communicator. I am not a representative of this forum and do not determine what you are required to know to post here. Your beef is with me not others here. Again, it was an ill chosen comment and I am sorry. It makes me sad because I feel you missed the entire point of my post. Good luck who ever you are and again, my apology. Cindy Butler

[FW]

FW - I am sorry, names have been changed. Please accept my appology.

Apology accepted :-)

[rchrds]

ooh oohh-

I was was just about to reach for the "ragin cindy" button, but she beat me to it. har har har. That's funny stuff. Flashbacks.

J

[FW]

B. Take care of your family, make sure you have a will, get insurance.

Good advice, but read the fine print, some life insurance policies exclude certian activities, like cave diving.

[Cindy]

Hey Jason! Dude, that was the mean, ill tempered Cindy you speak of! That went away with the hot flashes, besides I'm going to be 50 this year and I had to mellow a little with age. Are you going to the cavort? You can buy me a beer and we can celebrate cave diving unity..Cindy :)

[DeWayne]

I didn't realize that a requirement of being a cave diver was knowing who FW is. How am I supposed to know. I am New to this forum, not new to diving.

Easiest thing is to listen and learn. FW is probably one of the greatest people you will ever get the opportunity to meet, and afterwards you can think of him fondly every time you place a Wilson line arrow on a stretch of cave line 8)

[DeWayne]

Hey Jason! Dude, that was the mean, ill tempered Cindy you speak of!

I don't think I have ever met her 8) Was she related to you? :wink:

[Dan Thoms]

Hey Jason! Dude, that was the mean, ill tempered Cindy you speak of! That went away with the hot flashes, besides I'm going to be 50 this year and I had to mellow a little with age. Are you going to the cavort? You can buy me a beer and we can celebrate cave diving unity..Cindy :)

I dont see how your going to be 50, maybe the van, but not you. :)

[rchrds]

Hey Jason! Dude, that was the mean, ill tempered Cindy you speak of! Are you going to the cavort? You can buy me a beer and we can celebrate cave diving unity..Cindy :)

Hehe- yea- that alternate persona was funny! I wont be at the cavort until Sunday, C and I are caving elsewhere on Fri and Sat- There are enough folks coming that we might come in Friday night- Hey- can I get you to bring your breather? I will bring my two- I want to compare some notes.

J

What's yer beer choice- failure to select results in PBR! YEA!! :-D

[Cindy]

Hey Jason, I like red dog beer or some sort of dark beer. I can't drink until I get out of the cave though, last time I did that I got lost trying to find the van! :) I'll bring the rebreather but Duncan has the electronics and hasn't sent them back to me yet. Basicly right now it's just a sidemount oxygen rebreather.
The sidemount mouthpiece is pretty cool though. Try to show up for the fire on Sat. night and we can play with it then. See ya soon, Cindy

[rchrds]

The sidemount mouthpiece is pretty cool though. Try to show up for the fire on Sat. night and we can play with it then. See ya soon, Cindy

That's the part I want to see particularly. Thanks!

J

[Cindy]

Oops, my bad! I was just pulling out the rebreather and find that Duncan took the mouthpiece back with him to the UK, it wasn't mine. He had left a spare rebreather here but didn't leave that part I guess. I think Forrest had it made for him anyway. Sorry I haven't opened those boxes for a while. Cindy

[rchrds]

Oops, my bad! I was just pulling out the rebreather and find that Duncan took the mouthpiece back with him to the UK, it wasn't mine. He had left a spare rebreather here but didn't leave that part I guess. I think Forrest had it made for him anyway. Sorry I haven't opened those boxes for a while. Cindy

Dang it- you're a dirty tease. Your beer has been revoked. Now I have to sweet up to FW.

Shower up FW! I'm comin for ya!

har har

J

[FW]

The sidemount mouthpiece is pretty cool though.

Check the Sumpdivers forum :)

[Jay]

Nice post Cindy! One of your longer ones but well worth the read!
When are you crossing the pond?

Jay

[Cindy]

Hey Jay, I am not going to the UK after all. I lost my guide.

Forrest and TJ, I like the sump forum. It's a great place for Brian and I to post all our new finds!

Oops, got to wash gear, later, Cindy :)