wing size

[jsteedley]

I currently dive sidemount, transpac and trek wing and have noticed that I am having difficulty with buoyancy. I am using 95's with a stage steel 80. I have a classic wing but unfortunately the classis does not have the attachment on it to attach to sidemount paraphanalia. With this tank combo can the trek wing work?

[jsteedley]

Oh, yeah I know you can sew on the classic wing. If the trek will not work with the tank combo, then any suggestions on the sewing? :?

[lonestarfl]

Sorry to inindate you PM...I was having user errors.
Anyway, As I discussed the Trek wing will not be enough lift with three steel bottles unless you add a dry suit. Stick with the aluminum 80 for a stage unless you dive dry or go with a larger wing.
Lee

[Gary]

I currently dive sidemount, transpac and trek wing and have noticed that I am having difficulty with buoyancy. I am using 95's with a stage steel 80.

I think I have the same problem with the same equipment configuration. Too much to lift for my smaller (and modified) trek wing.

I added a second (classic wing) wing on the inside of my transpack. Not only will does it provide extra bouyancy for the bigger dives but also added comfort due to the air cushion between my ribs and the tank - and backup bouyancy should I have a problem with the trek wing.

[FW]

Oh, yeah I know you can sew on the classic wing. If the trek will not work with the tank combo, then any suggestions on the sewing? :?

Rennaker was selling modified classic wings, with loops sewn in for sidemount. I have one, it works great.

I have set gromets in the cordura wing shell, to put my own loops in. Be careful not to nick the bladder.

Another option would be take the wing cover off, and take it to an upolstry shop to do the sewing.

[Angie Reim]

I currently dive sidemount, transpac and trek wing and have noticed that I am having difficulty with buoyancy. I am using 95's with a stage steel 80.

I think I have the same problem with the same equipment configuration. Too much to lift for my smaller (and modified) trek wing.

I added a second (classic wing) wing on the inside of my transpack. Not only will does it provide extra bouyancy for the bigger dives but also added comfort due to the air cushion between my ribs and the tank - and backup bouyancy should I have a problem with the trek wing.

Hey Greg,

Do you have a picture of your setup? I have a set of HP100's and PST95's. Rather than get rid of the 95's - I'd like to be able to use what I got to make a better rig. I'm using a TREK but I have a CLASSIC just sitting in the closet. The 95's are heavy and riding too low for a good sidemount profile. I'm open to suggestions to correct it. If I really have to, I'll trade someone for a pair of 85's but I hate to have to give up the capacity. I don't have fetus lungs like you and Moon. :-D

We can take this offline if you like. PM me. :D

[Tegg]

I use a classic wing and have been able to dive wet with 2 108s, 2 al 80s and a 40...

http://deepintentions.com/sidemount

I have made several modifications to this setup, but the basic idea is the same... have over 100 dives on the rig, no problems as of yet... :)

Of course I now dive dry... after 3+ hrs in 72 degree water, a wetsuit can only help so much... :wink:

[rchrds]

Both C and i use the small single tank wing (Diverite sold them before the Trek came around) and have always been happy- but the realization is that nothing larger than 95's can be dove unless dry. Since we no longer dive wet unless it is sump, where we never have such large tanks, it is not an issue. The problem with the larger wings is that they invariably "fly away" behind the shoulderblades. The Armadillo does not, that I have seen, but as I have mentioned previously make sure they fit your body size. Anyway- The little wing produces almost no drag- it does squeeze your guts at full inflation, but even with my 120's halfway through the dive it is very comfortable. Unfortunately for you (the original poster) you may be stuck using smaller tanks (which is not a bad thing- there are many places you have to have steel 80's or smaller) until you decide to go dry. Try ditching the steel stage for aluminum- that will help quite a bit. You also werent really clear on what sort of bouyancy problems- Everyone is sort of assuming lack of bouyancy, but are you rolling in one or two axis as well?

J

[Angie Reim]

I use a classic wing and have been able to dive wet with 2 108s, 2 al 80s and a 40...

http://deepintentions.com/sidemount

I have made several modifications to this setup, but the basic idea is the same... have over 100 dives on the rig, no problems as of yet... :)

Of course I now dive dry... after 3+ hrs in 72 degree water, a wetsuit can only help so much... :wink:

Hey Tegg -

When you turn 90degrees through a restriction, do you find that your tanks want to bounce around a bit or are they fairly stable? I find that I still have too much play in my tanks during a roll. Your pic's have given me some great ideas for what to do with the various parts I have about the house. :D Thanks!

[Tegg]

Hey Tegg -

When you turn 90degrees through a restriction, do you find that your tanks want to bounce around a bit or are they fairly stable? I find that I still have too much play in my tanks during a roll. Your pic's have given me some great ideas for what to do with the various parts I have about the house. :D Thanks!

I find that they are pretty stable.

The only thing that has really bothered me on my rig is when thigs get "tight (as in I exhale to move)" I notice that my inflator elbow gets abused... I am working on something for that... might move the inflator and put a dump there (similar to the Armadillo)...

Take everything that I have done with a huge grain of salt... I am by no means an expert in sidemount... I just took tips from several people who have thousands of sidemount dives...

[FW]

I use a classic wing and have been able to dive wet with 2 108s, 2 al 80s and a 40...

http://deepintentions.com/sidemount

I have made several modifications to this setup, but the basic idea is the same... have over 100 dives on the rig, no problems as of yet... :)


Nice pictures, Joe !

A couple of suggestions:

1. Get a gromet set from your local camping store, and re-inforce the holes in the wing.

2. I find it is better to tie the edges of the wing accross my chest, rather than to the transpac. It makes the wing into a "jacket" and the wing doesn't "fly" or "flap" above your back. I have straps across my chest that go to the edge of the wing.

I guess I need to get some pictures, huh? :-)

[Tegg]

I use a classic wing and have been able to dive wet with 2 108s, 2 al 80s and a 40...

http://deepintentions.com/sidemount

I have made several modifications to this setup, but the basic idea is the same... have over 100 dives on the rig, no problems as of yet... :)


Nice pictures, Joe !

A couple of suggestions:

1. Get a gromet set from your local camping store, and re-inforce the holes in the wing.

2. I find it is better to tie the edges of the wing accross my chest, rather than to the transpac. It makes the wing into a "jacket" and the wing doesn't "fly" or "flap" above your back. I have straps across my chest that go to the edge of the wing.

I guess I need to get some pictures, huh? :-)

Guess I need to take newer pics... fixed both of those issues... ;)

I was hving a blowfish effect behind my shoulders so I went to a luggage repair shop and had him do some modifications for me... I'll work on updating those pics this weekend...

[jsteedley]

You also werent really clear on what sort of bouyancy problems- Everyone is sort of assuming lack of bouyancy, but are you rolling in one or two axis as well?

J

Thanks for all of the suggestions and comments everyone. J, my bouyancy problems were just sinking straight down, no axis problems. I converted to the steel 80 and phased out my 1978 al 80 as the shop would not fill and I think that was when the problem began. I will try an extra post '78 al 80 that I have to see if that helps. The great thing about sidemount is the ever changing configuration.

[ARY]

I'm still looking for XXL jacket to cannibalize it into horded sm BC. And i was thinking of replacing hose inflator with drysuit inflation valve or something like scubapro started to equip their jacket BC with: one small flat hoseless inflation-deflation valve with button. The idea is to put it on a bottom of jacket (where the dump valve is). Then LP hose will connect directly to inflation valve and it will be routed hidden inside of a jacket. The dump valve will be moved to back as it is done in Armadillo.

I currently use very modified Trek wing and myself made sump harness (you can rappel in it without any modification) with similar to Armadillo inflation idea. Dump valve with polyethilene coated stainless steel fishing cord put through surgical tube is running in nylon sleeve sewn to shoulder strap. At the end of a cord i have small pull knob, which i use to dump air from the wing. Corrugated long hose is attached to the bottom (where dump valve initially was). So far it worked good except one case when duckweed clogged back mounted dump valve which caused continuous air seepage. Stainless steel cord idea was suggested by Jeff Hancock (who however criticized the idea of reversing dumpvalve with inflator hose) and whoes itself jacket style sm BC looks so extremely well trimmed.

Any way my questions:
- does anybody know where i can find separate scubapro all-in-one inflator valves or inexpensive drysuit inflators? Did someone tried to get rid of corrugated hose completely (i understand that it provides extra breathing backup and mouth inflation backup but i already carry 3 regs and two LP inflation hoses with me)?
- how do i install extra valve on bladder, just cut the hole, silicone it and screw the valve pieces or is it more complicated thing?
- what are all possible drawbacks of Armadilo style bottom hose inflation ?

PS: just fond that link to scubapro valves: http://www.scubapro.co.uk/products.asp?P=471 Who sells them locally BTW?